Business

#40: New Age Consulting & Building a Unified Field Theory with Mitch Gonsalves

Hosted by Josh Gonsalves
4.5.2021
2 HR 09 MIN
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Episode Description

Mitch shares his sales & marketing strategies that has grown his consulting company to over $2.5 million dollars per year, how to cultivate a winner's mindset, building a Unified Field Theory of interconnected ideas, and a lot more.

About Mitch Gonsalves

Mitch Gonsalves is the Founder & CEO of Executive Advantage a Consulting firm that helps Coaches, Consultants, Agencies & Service Businesses scale to $100k/month and beyond through LinkedIn, Systems and Commission-Only Sales Teams. He has helped over 400+ Companies and grown his own business to over $2.4m/year.

Connect with Mitch

If you enjoy the podcast, would you please consider leaving a short review on Apple Podcasts

https://apple.co/2Y86xww

It takes less than 60 seconds, and it really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests.

Stalk Josh on the Internet:

Twitter: (https://twitter.com/joshgonsalves_)

Instagram: (https://instagram.com/joshgonsalves_)

Facebook: (https://facebook.com/gonsalvesmedia)

LinkedIn: (https://linkedin.com/in/joshgonsalves94)

YouTube: (https://youtube.com/joshgonsalves)

Thanks for coming this far! if you're reading this, it is no accident. The universe brought you to this corner of the internet for a reason, and you're on the right track. I already know that you're an amazing person and I can't wait to connect with you!

— Josh

If you enjoy the podcast,

would you please consider leaving a short review on Apple Podcasts

It takes less than 60 seconds, and it really makes a difference in helping to convince hard-to-get guests.

Stalk Josh on the Internet:

  • 00:25 — Intro
  • 02:53 — Conversation begins
  • 03:46 — Mitch is focusing on Organic YouTube videos and paid YouTube ads for his business
  • 05:24 — Maximize one piece of content and then distribute it and kind of put it in different mediums to get the most reach.
  • 06:21 — Mitch's company Executive Advantage
  • 07:34 — Mind Meld with James Jani
  • 08:33 — Mitch talks about his journey in business before starting Executive Advantage
  • 09:19 — Mitch's passion in business is with marketing and sales
  • 09:31 — Consulting.com
  • 10:15 — Ty Lopez iconic "Here In My Garage" ad
  • 11:00 — Consulting.com gave Mitch structure he says when he went through the mindset portion of it, that changed his entire life.
  • 11:58 — Mitch: "People pay for outcomes and results. They don't pay for products and services, they pay for results"
  • 17:30 — SaaS Consulting Model
  • 17:59 — three-prong approach of combining courses, consulting and community
  • 18:13 — Mitch uses circle.so to host the Executive Advantage community
  • 20:14 — Executive Advantage has four elements: the course, consulting calls, online community and software.
  • 21:00 — Webflow University
  • 21:33 — Mind Meld with PB+J
  • 21:58 — How Mitch figured out that you wanted to help consultants
  • 22:12 — from age 18 till about 22, Mitch was trading currencies and commodities.
  • 24:40 — How Mitch started working with his business partner Glen
  • 26:48 — Zapier and Airtable killer no code combination
  • 28:01 — Mind Meld with Sam Marfleet
  • 28:05 — putting up the bat signal / putting nodes out in the network
  • 29:59 — Opportunities with No-code tools
  • 32:47 — with technology, there's always cycles of bundling and unbundling
  • 33:58 — Sales & Marketing strategies and philosophies
  • 34:21 — most businesses lack the front end marketing. actually generating the leads and then getting them to convert into appointments.
  • 34:43 — Mitch uses LinkedIn organic and built an automation tool to automate that process.
  • 34:54 — multi-channel approach to marketing & sales by merging inbound and outbound sales.
  • 36:25 — Retargeting ads are much cheaper than cold traffic advertising
  • 37:58 — Facebook banned Mitch's ad account (among many others) so he was forced to pivot to YouTube ads
  • 38:12 — Mitch: "the biggest thing that you need to solve is getting appointments on the calendar. Right? If you can do that, if you can light up the calendar, then you, there's no way you won't succeed, but that's where a lot of people need help with is like, they just need to volume and they need to focus on the right types of clients that they actually are attracting."
  • 38:56 — Mitch's sales process
  • 39:36 — when you switched to selling transformations and desired futures, rather than products and services, it will change the game for you
  • 39:58 — Mitch: "I learned that when you're at the end of the call, you're not, you're not closing them. You're opening the relationship, that's a mind shift as well."
  • 40:21 — Mitch: "Your the one that has the antidote or the medicine to cure them, to deliver the transformation. When you truly believe that they're the ones that are basically selling you."
  • 43:54 — Mitch: "I don't like describing the product and service. You're prescribing it like a doctor"
  • 47:38 — How to make sure your clients succeed with your program or solution
  • 48:26 — Creating accountability for your clients
  • 49:18 — Negative Reverse Sell
  • 49:53 — Fostering positive Community culture
  • 51:02 — Mitch: "in terms of fostering community, one guarding the gates, making sure you're actually selling the right people into it."
  • 52:09 — Creating cultural norms: "we have something called like booms. When they get a sale or when they have a good outcome, they post a boom. People celebrate and they post images and gifs and all that stuff in the community."
  • 53:04 — Mindset Training
  • 53:17 — Mind Meld with Marie Poulin
  • 54:06 — Mitch leaked one of his modules called structure formation, and it's all about building habits and he gives you tools.
  • 54:44 — Mitch: "the very first thing I get people to do. Well, the second thing is I get them to structure up their schedule, to block out the time to actually invest the time into it. Right. And prioritize it because you're whatever you're like, whatever your results you're seeing, like are just a dictated based on the priorities that you have."
  • 55:07 — "if you look at the root definition of what actually priority means, it means one thing, basically."
  • 56:01 — Newsfeed Eradicator - a Chrome extension that removes your Facebook newsfeed, remove recommendations on YouTube.
  • 56:12 — How to become like a high-performance entrepreneur
  • 57:58 — Becoming a thermostat instead of a thermometer
  • 58:53 — "Winners are like high performance individuals that you'd be like athletes. They just sustain that level of performance through anything they're just like ruthlessly consistent."
  • 59:14 — Meta learning / the Unified Field Theory
  • 59:21 — "in today's day and age, it's not just about learning, it's learning how to learn and how to like take the information and apply it to a high level"
  • 01:00:14 — Stepping into character and creating a new identity
  • 01:00:36 — Book: Badass Habits by Jen Sincero
  • 01:01:00 — Book: Atomic Habits by James Clear
  • 01:01:08 — Mitch tells his "burning of the blanket" story
  • 01:01:23 — Mitch: "anytime you want to create massive breakthroughs or changes in your life, you need to change who you are. Right. And not like your true like self, like who are you? It's like your self image, more of like what's built up from society"
  • 01:02:01 — Book: Psycho-Cybernetics by Maxwell Maltz
  • 01:05:20 — Creating positive feedback loops to reinforce your new identity
  • 01:07:33 — The story of the Theranos fraud
  • 01:08:23 — imposter syndrome
  • 01:10:57 — the artists' approach to self-development
  • 01:11:31 — Sculpting yourself and the world around you
  • 01:12:19 — Josh describes seeing his life in 3rd person view for the first time as a kid riding his bike
  • 01:15:41 — How Mitch developed a "winner mindset" and positive self image
  • 01:20:50 — Two ways to level up: Kensho and Satori
  • 01:20:59 — Mindvalley
  • 01:22:15 — Visualize Value / Jack Butcher
  • 01:22:50 — Josh describes his traumatic kensho experience
  • 01:23:57 — Mitch describes his Kensho moment
  • 01:28:49 — Mitch spends more money on online courses and mentorship than most people does for University or College
  • 01:30:24 — find a peer group or like a mentor, and you're surrounding yourself with people who are levels ahead of you, then you're getting pulled up a level.
  • 01:30:52 — Setting a new standard for yourself by surrounding yourself with people ahead of you.
  • 01:34:43 — Compounding knowledge through the podcast
  • 01:35:02 — Learning through sharing and teaching
  • 01:38:45 — Mitch describes his Unified Field theory
  • 01:40:04 — Book: Poor Charlie's Almanack by Charlie Munger
  • 01:40:20 — the Lollapalooza Effect, which is when all of those interconnected ideas converge
  • 01:41:42 — being full stack / interdisciplinary
  • 01:43:13 — Roam Research for managing interconnected ideas
  • 01:43:52 — Neauralink
  • 01:45:00 — organizing knowledge
  • 01:49:22 — Readwise syncs your Kindle highlights and adds it to Notion or Roam.
  • 01:50:14 — Josh describes the process of how he learns through this podcast
  • 01:50:44 — Josh transcribes the podcast and makes notes using Descript
  • 01:51:20 — Josh writes detailed show notes for every episode of this podcast
  • 01:52:17 — Learning through interactive conversation
  • 01:52:32 — Book: Meditations by Marcus Aurelius
  • 01:53:46 — Mitch prefers to learn by doing, or by doing simulations.
  • 01:55:30 — "if you understand the customer so well, that's when sales become redundant"
  • 01:56:17 — Longboi Apparel
  • 01:56:30 — The Advertising Oligopoly with Facebook and Google
  • 01:57:06 — the two largest search engines in the world, Google and YouTube.
  • 01:59:00 — Josh is very bullish on TikTok and repurposing YouTube videos for TikTok.
  • 02:00:16 — Curating your TikTok feed to give you educational and useful videos
  • 02:02:47 — What Mitch would tell his 10 year younger self.
  • 02:02:56 — Mitch: "I would tell myself to start early and hang out with the right people and I would probably start reading books and starting to really build up my self confidence and my self image"
  • 02:04:42 — Books Mitch recommends to his younger self: Relentless by Tim Grover. Psycho-Cybernetics by Maxwel Maltz, Awaken The Giant Within by Tony Robbins, Think and Grow Rich by Napoleon Hill, and Rich Dad Poor Dad by Robert Kiyosaki
  • 02:05:25 — Mitch: "I really fell in love with helping people transform themselves in their businesses."
  • 02:07:28 — Link to Mitch's leaked module on YouTube
  • 02:07:32 — Check out Mitch's YouTube channel
  • 02:07:43 — Connect with Mitch on LinkedIn

[00:00:00] Mitch: it's a lot bigger than just courses. I don't consider myself a course creator or anything. I consider myself an entrepreneur. I solve problems and I'm constantly figuring out how can I provide better value, solve problems, faster, quicker, more profound results. and the way that you deliver that information is through the course because I can then service 5,000 people and have to say at once really good, rather than me and you consulting, I'd just be repeating myself 5,000 times

[00:00:25] Josh: Hello, and welcome to Mind Meld. I'm Josh Gonsalves and this is a podcast where I have in-depth conversations with some of the brightest people in the known universe. My aim is to spark deep conversations around interesting topics to find the tools, tactics, strategies, and philosophies that we can all use in our daily and creative lives.

[00:01:01]In this episode, I sat down with my brother, Mitch Gonsalves.

[00:01:05]Mitch is the founder and CEO of Executive Advantage, a consulting firm that has helped over 400 coaches, consultants, and agencies scale with automated sales systems. In this episode of Mitch share some of his sales and marketing strategies that has helped grow his company to over two and a half million dollars per year.

[00:01:24]Mitch share some of his philosophies on the new model for consulting and how he leverages systems to scale businesses. We also go deep on cultivating what Mitch calls, the winner's mindset. We talk about building a positive self image and how to upgrade your character to level up your life in business. We also get into this idea of building a lattice work of knowledge or connected ideas in life. Mitch calls this the unified field theory, and he believes that such an important aspect of entrepreneurship in today's day and age.

[00:01:54]This is another wide ranging conversation where Mitch and I talk about a lot of different things that help we'll bring some insight and inspiration into your life.

[00:02:03] If you found this podcast helpful or interesting, please share it with your friends or anyone that you think needs to hear this.

[00:02:09] And if you haven't already please subscribe to the podcast. You can subscribe on your favorite podcast app so you can get notified when I publish new episodes every Monday.

[00:02:18]If you want to dive deeper into any of the things that we brought up in this podcast, whether it's direct links to resources, people, tools, or books that we mentioned in this podcast, you can find everything in the show notes for this episode.

[00:02:30] You can find the link to the show notes in the description of this podcast, or you can go directly to Mind Meld dot FM. That's M I N D M E L D dot fm.

[00:02:41]I hope you enjoy this episode, so let's get right into it.   I'm Josh Gonsalves and this is Mind Meld with Mitch Gonsalves.  

[00:02:53] All right. Welcome to Mind Meld Mitch. I'm so glad to finally have you on the podcast. I feel like this is completely so long overdue. I, you know, I think people would think you'd be like one of my first guests, which maybe you probably should've, but glad that you're here, dude. So welcome to Mind Meld.

[00:03:09] Mitch: Yeah, I know man. Very long overdue. You kept asking me and you know, we finally got things rolling. And so I'm excited to be on, man. But yeah, man, excited to kind of dive in. I don't know what kind of Mind Melding activities we're going to get into, but I'm pretty excited.

[00:03:22]Josh: Yeah. Who knows what will be Mind Meld in about that's the beauty of these things, man. It just takes us on the flow of our minds. But yeah man, it's funny. You mentioned you're not a podcast, but you are getting into YouTube. So like you've had some episodes or I guess some like vlogs and like educational content, but now you're like really diving into it. So you're really getting into the content game.

[00:03:41] So maybe you can kind of jump into that first dude. Like what are you kind of working on? Because I know your main focus right now is YouTube, both organic and paid ads on YouTube.

[00:03:50] Mitch: Yeah. I mean right now, With the way the internet is, man. Like you think about how people are interacting with each other and everything is shifting more and more and more towards video, right? And even you started doing the video on the podcast. And I just see as like, I'm very, very bullish on YouTube, just because that's anybody I talk to really even entrepreneurs, even some of my mentors, they only use YouTube and they love YouTube.

[00:04:21] And because it's the nature of long form content, you can build relationships, you can see the other person build rapport and you can get into like deeper topics and consume it. Almost like, like TV. Like I don't even, you know, me, I don't even own a TV. I haven't for like four years and I don't watch TV. I don't watch or consume the news, anything like that.

[00:04:42] So like, even in terms of running my own traffic, it's, it's a good way to build relationships with my community, right? Because formerly I was just running ads and doing some like, you know, prospecting and to build the business. But now I really want to build up more of like a community and really just build relationships with people online.

[00:05:03] And especially with YouTube ads, Facebook, we can get into all of that later on Facebook ads and YouTube ads. But I see YouTube, I'm very bullish on just YouTube ads and YouTube organic and taking those YouTube videos. Cause you can repurpose them right. And transcribe them, put them as like a blog on the site.

[00:05:21] And so this is, uh, a lot of different ways that you can do it, send it to your email list. There's a lot of ways you can maximize one piece of content and then distribute it and kind of put it in different mediums to get the most reach. So I'm very bullish on YouTube and YouTube ads. That's kind of what I really focus on.

[00:05:38] And especially with other stuff we're doing, but that's kind of why I want to do YouTube. And then also, you know, the aspect, like I mentioned earlier, just building relationships with people because I've been more, you know, kind of in the dark, in the trenches now I got to kind of come to light show people the true side, you know, maybe show some beats and stuff, you know?

[00:05:57] Josh: Oh, dude. Yeah. There's so much content you can be putting out there, like just aside from business. So. Well, I want to get into all that, but like, maybe just for people listening, just so they get like a little bit of an overview of what you do and like that your business that you've run, maybe you can talk about Executive Advantage and what you guys are doing.

[00:06:12] And what you've been working on for like the last year really is when you kind of brought into like Executive Advantage 2.0, so like maybe you can shed some light on that first.

[00:06:21] Mitch: Yeah. So Executive Advantage is a online consulting company. We have online training programs and consulting programs to essentially help people grow and scale businesses with really low overhead, low costs and do it in a way that's like hyper profitable. So we've been doing that for, I'd say this is three years formula.

[00:06:43] I think. Executive vantage, but I've been doing kind of this for like the past six years. And the last 12 months, like you mentioned, I was just in the trenches building great products and good customer experience for our clients because once I grew it and we expanded now, you obviously got to, you know, hone and refine the process.

[00:07:02] And so I've just been the last 12 months, really making a really great product that I can really scale and that can help a lot more people and multiple to two different ways. But that's kind of what we've been working on is really just building great product and helping our clients get just more profound results.

[00:07:22] Josh: Yeah, dude, I think what's really cool is that you really like. Took on the, like the internet, age of consulting. I mean, I mean, I don't know how much you want to get into it. I've brought up consulting.com and I'm on the episode with James Jani. We mentioned Sam Ovens. Some people have like mixed thoughts of him, but maybe you can shed some light because you know, you've been working with them for years and consulting.com really, I think, has changed your life in so many ways.

[00:07:48] Like it really opened up the whole different business route for you. And then you hopped on this like internet, age of consulting, right? Like you said, it's not just, one-on-one working with people being like, Hey, like book a call. And then like, you know, the traditional forms of consulting, there's like a whole new way of consulting.

[00:08:03] And it's almost like you're on the forefront of like the online education and like these online courses, like so many people are doing it now, but I don't think we have the right idea of like what it actually is, which is just like a new form of consulting. So maybe you can kind of shed some light on that first to that consulting that calm, how you first learned about that and sort of what it's done for you and like sort of upgraded your business in life.

[00:08:26] Cause I think some people have some mixed feelings about it, right. But maybe you can shed some light on it. Like you're, you've been down that rabbit hole.

[00:08:33] Mitch: Yeah. And not even just them in, because I've tried so many different business models before I even got onto this. And I feel like that's a lot of people, like if they don't know what they want to do, throw a bunch of darts at the dartboard. And you're going to hit the bulls-eye eventually, you know, and I feel like you got to just try a bunch of different things.

[00:08:51] I don't know if you remember, but back when I was like 18 man, and when I was dropped out of college, I was literally putting up bandit signs to flip houses. Right. I'd be going in like Oshawa and like the, in the ghetto and putting up bandit signs because I was trying to get houses under contract and know what's going to real estate events.

[00:09:09] And then I started an e-com store, a fishing store called uh, top tier fishing gear that I sold eventually. I don't know if it's still running, but I did a whole bunch of different things. And then really what my passion was and really what I found was like business really in marketing and sales. And the thing is like, when I was about 18, when I came across Sam, um, at consulting.com, but it's a lot larger, I think from just like consulting in general of like how the, like the world kind of shifted, especially rapidly going forward.

[00:09:41] But I got, I got introduced to him when I was like 18. I was, I was one of those guys that wanted to be successful at a really high level. I was always entrepreneurial as you know, like I was doing so many different things when I was younger, I'd like car detailing in our, in our parents' driveway right out. I literally go on Kijiji and just post ads and like wash people's cars. I'd go. I was very entrepreneurial.

[00:10:05] But really when I came to Sam I needed the structure. Right. And I think it initially how I, how I actually got in touch with Sam, was from, I think Ty Lopez from his here in my garage ad in like 2015.

[00:10:19] Right. Everyone knows that ad. Right. That got me because he was like, you want a Lamborghini, basically read some books. And so I started reading a ton of books. Then I bought his programs, uh, Ties programs, but it was just getting me into like the state of entrepreneurship and like getting me into like, okay, what am I going to do with business?

[00:10:37] And that's when I started the real estate thing, um, e-comm all that stuff. And then I started at an agency. And with the agency, I grew that to a point where I was generating clients and I was doing it by myself as well, but I needed structure. that's when I jumped into Sam's program, his initial, and this was before he had the, um, new version of accelerator. It was before that. Right.

[00:10:59] And so he gave me structure and more so when I went through the mindset portion of it, that changed my entire life. And I think that whatever people want to think about Sam or whoever or online courses, it's one concept, one piece of information, even one quote could change your life, how you look at things, right. And it was more like these causal elements, all combined together with the structure of how you structure your business, how you actually solve problems. Right.

[00:11:36] Because, like you were saying with this online consulting or even consulting in general, people pay money to solve problems. Right. And so that's what Sam really taught me is that find a gnarly, painful problem that people have and go and solve that problem.

[00:11:54] Right. And really just package it up in a way where people pay for the results. They pay for outcomes and results. They don't pay for products and services, they pay for results. Right. And so that was a kind of mind shift for me. And I just started offering higher value services in my consulting.

[00:12:11]I got really good at marketing and sales from just doing it in the, in the trenches, right. I would go out either door knocking, cold calling, cold emailing. Then I got into LinkedIn, started learning that process and I started helping businesses and financial advisors grow using that method.

[00:12:28] And I was from finding their problem, which Sam really helped me. And then I started to really scale the consulting business by just focusing on that one painful problem, and how can I get really good at that until, you know. But I think from Sam, like working with Sam and I'm still in his mastermind for six years later, um, it, it's just a level of thinking.

[00:12:53] It's, it's a lot bigger than just courses. I don't consider myself a course creator or anything. I consider myself an entrepreneur. Right. I solve problems and I'm constantly figuring out how can I provide better value, higher value, solve problems, faster, quicker, more profound results. So it's, and the way that you deliver that information is through the course because I can then service 5,000 people and have to say at once really good, rather than me and you consulting, I'd just be repeating myself 5,000 times, but then having an element of actual consulting where you can hop on like an actual live call with me and my team where we can like chat.

[00:13:31] I think that element of a course in conjunction with getting that direct feedback from a mentor or from a consultants, or to say, or an advisor, you can really have that connection that takes the things from the course and gives you an actionable, customized to you. So I think the way of consulting is it shifts the way people think about it, shifting their mind, and like it just helping people deliver a transformation and just get really good at delivering that transformation.

[00:14:00] And then that's really, all I do now is just deliver transformations for people.

[00:14:04]Josh: man, There's so many things to get into from that, because I think first of all, the transformation thing is fucking wild because that's exactly what it is. Right? People are at point A, they want to get to a point B and you're that bridge. Right. You're just giving them that transformation, which I think is really, really cool.

[00:14:17] And that's exactly what consulting is. But like I said, you, you, brought it into this new world of like, instead of repeating yourself, 5,000 times, like getting on the call or doing video calls nowadays. It's like, you can do the, you create a system once here's the transformation go through it as a proven system.

[00:14:32] No work for you. So I guess my question too, just, I mean, obviously I know we talked about this stuff quite a bit, but for anyone listening, who are the people that you service, that you kind of help and, um, what is that transformation that you're actually providing them?

[00:14:48]Mitch: Yeah, for sure. And, and one of the things I want to say on that is a lot of courses, they don't give you that structure. Like you're saying they don't have like a point A to point B, it just, here's a bunch of information or I'm going to sell you on this dream, and then here's a bunch of shit. I just regurgitated. And hopefully you can piece something together and get results,

[00:15:06] but exactly like that, man, once you have, like, I think it comes from experience and just doing self cause all the stuff that I teach in my program, we use for our own business. So it's like once you have that system, someone can plug into it and it's just like a predictable set of action steps to get a predictable result.

[00:15:24] Right. And so who we service to answer your question is service-based businesses. So mainly like coaches, consultants, freelancers, um, agencies. Um, we also help a lot of like it consultants, staffing companies, financial advisors, insurance agents. So really anyone that has a higher ticket service company that needs to get on the phone with prospects.

[00:15:46] Um, we help them essentially scale their business to about a hundred grand a month. That's the transformation. So if they're usually existing businesses, we don't really work with like completely newbies. And so there are roughly doing around like five, 10 K a month and they just need to assist them one.

[00:16:04] I think a lot of them need to simplify their business and we can get into more details, but we help them really just simplify their business, put in systems to get appointments and then build out a sales mechanism to scale. Like whether it's, um, running YouTube ads, right. Or running traffic through LinkedIn.

[00:16:22] Right. And then building out a sales team so they can scale to a hundred grand plus a month. So that's, our transformation is about five, 10 K a month to a hundred grand a month as a transformation.

[00:16:31] Josh: Right. And that mechanism, or I guess like the way that they're doing that is just by getting sales appointments. Right. So it's like, I think that's the biggest thing, especially with like any kind of freelancer, like you said, any kind of service-based business, like the biggest bottleneck is like getting people at the top of the funnel, like into their sales calls.

[00:16:48] Right. Cause it's like, especially freelancing, it can be like feast or famine. Right. So I think it's a really good thing for people to know, like this kind of sales side, like you can't just rely on, I don't know, like, you know, just tweeting or posting on Instagram. Like there needs to be some like outbound sales.

[00:17:04] So I think it's really interesting that you're kind of doing that. Um, and you found all of these mechanisms and these procedures just by doing it yourself. Right. Which is kind of cool. Um, And obviously from you going through other courses and learning from other people and then taking the best bits of it, putting it all into one, then you made like this really neat package, this neat system.

[00:17:24] But I think what's cool is it's like you said, it's more than just like a course. Like it's not just people going through this course. Like it's also, like we talked about this new model of like the SaaS consulting. It's like, you're, you're, you're also consulting on like a certain software or like a tool to be able to get those results as well.

[00:17:40] But you can't just teach them, like, that's just like one module, right. That would just be, Hey, here's how to use this tool. But there's much more than that. Like I know you've, you've snuck in mindset. We'll definitely go deep on mindset and why that's so important. But the bigger thing too, is the way that you've structured your business.

[00:17:56] I'm seeing this a lot of people doing it nowadays, and it's like this three-prong approach and it's like courses consulting and community. So like the courses is like, it can be multiple courses. The consulting is those like, you know, weekly calls where people can come on and they can ask questions and then the community.

[00:18:12] So I know you recently just switched over to circle. That's been a big one. A lot of people have been using, um, for the communities. So it's like these three prong things to give them like a holistic system and like a base. Like, I love how you brought that up. It's like a foundation for them and you're giving them like, here's a system.

[00:18:29] Like, literally just follow this, ask questions, you can improve upon it. You can innovate on it, but like here's what works and just go and do that. Um, and would you say like for you was consulting.com, what I guess consulting accelerator was that one of the big things that kind of, um, inspired you to do it this way? Cause they, they, they kind of started doing that pretty early on, right? Like 20 what? 16, 2017. So I know it's catching fire now, but like I think you guys were one of the earlier people to move on to that.

[00:19:02] Mitch: Yeah, because just having a course with no human interaction, like you've probably been in some programs or some CU Boston make maybe some there's a lot of like those that you've been cheaper courses that you can buy that they don't have these elements. Right. But

[00:19:18] Josh: Well, like a Skillshare or something

[00:19:20] Mitch: yeah. Like you Demi or whatever, but when you don't have a, because again, it goes back into the transformation. Right. And so when you're delivering a transformation, man, like the course is going to get you so far, right. But I know so many times where someone just hops in a call, I just tell them one thing and then it completely shifts their mindset and they come back to me like a month later and they're crushing like 5,000 grand a month.

[00:19:45] You know, it's like, just like that tweak in like, getting that customized attention to in like, sometimes you're questioning yourself, you need to like bounce your ideas off a mentor. Like I think that's one of the things that really separates us too, is like the level of support we do give like me Jeff and our whole teamand Glen,, we are like obsessive about the customer, like getting them results.

[00:20:05] But definitely with the course, it needs to be a system that's vetted, that's proven and that someone could plug into, but then need those other elements. And like, like you mentioned, we actually have four elements. Ours is the program or the course, the live consulting calls with me every week, the community, and then software, like you mentioned.

[00:20:23] Right? So we have a software that we built in that Glenn was building my business partner for the past, like 12 months while I was building the course and pairing those together is what gets them. Because if they just use a tool, they need to know how to use the tool most effectively, right. To get the result because tools just by themselves, like you're gonna have a hammer, but it's not going to build you a house.

[00:20:44] Right. So you need to be able to use them and have the, the floor plan or the blueprint, actually go out and build it successfully and save time, cut costs, cut inefficiencies, so you can get there faster.

[00:20:55]Josh: Man, that's a good point. And like, I don't see a lot of people doing it that way. I see the other way around. Right. I've seen, I think Webflow is actually the best example of this, where they built the tool first, and then they created amazing courses and, um, and full on programs on how to use it. Right.

[00:21:11] They have like intro to web design. They have like a intro to HTML and CSS and then learn how to use Webflow. But you almost took it from the other way around. It's like, here's the process. Here's, um, you know, the transformation they want, Oh, let's also build a tool that will help them get there and let's pair the two.

[00:21:28] So it's kind of like a nice like sandwich that you've like squished together. There really nicely. Like, uh, I've had these guys on before. They're the PB and J they have an agency called PB and J and that's kind of what they talk about. It's like, it's just like the PB, they called it PB and J cause it's like the very essence of like combination. Like if you think about combination foods like PB and J is like the perfect thing, like the peanut butter and jelly sandwich is perfect.

[00:21:51] Yeah. It's pretty cool, man. I think that's a really good business model. Um, yeah. I, I want to know though, I want to figure out first, how did you actually figure out that you wanted to help consultants specifically? What, what, what was it about that specific group that you wanna help?

[00:22:08]Mitch: My goal was to just cause at the time when I was about like from about 18 to 21, I was, till about 22, actually I was trading currencies and commodities. Right. So I was like really heavily involved in like the financial markets. Like I would trade every day, like three, four hours a day and I was doing it for years.

[00:22:29] And before I had my consulting business, I was doing that 12 hours a day. Right. So I was, you know, I was like heavily immersed into like the foreign exchange markets and stuff like that. And I was doing decent with it, but I didn't have capital to like really grow. And so then that's when I really like went harder on my agency and I went harder on the consulting side.

[00:22:53] But when I was doing that, I was helping only financial planners. I only helped financial planners. And I like so many people would message me and say like, how are you doing like LinkedIn? Like, can you help me, like grow my business, my agency or my consulting business. And I was like, no, I'm just, I only work with financial planners or financial advisors.

[00:23:11] So I just kept turning people down. And then this one kid went through my financial advisor funnel and he was 19 and I was like 21. And he's like, man, I'm going after accountants. Can you help me get clients? I have zero clients. Right. And I was like, you know what, man, I'll help you. So I took that strategy session, which I was not, I was going to close a client one.

[00:23:31] I just said, no, man, let's just map it out. So I pulled up a Google doc and I just gave him step by step. Here's how to do it. And then I think I gave him maybe like a Loom video or something like that after. And. I just, he just, I didn't talk to him three weeks later, he comes back to me is making seven grand a month.

[00:23:47] Right. And so I'm like, okay, well this says 19 year old kid, and now he's at 60 grand a month. When last time I talked to him and, uh, and he'll be at a hundred grand pretty soon. But, um, from that, then I was like, Oh wow, like maybe I can help other people. And it was really enjoyable cause he took massive action.

[00:24:05] Just got results. So I'm like, okay, these are the people I want to work with. And then I did a webinar and I just posted on my Facebook here, I'm doing a webinar. I'm keeping it to like really tight knit group. And it's not a typical webinar. Like I showed people exactly what I was doing and I gave them a cheat sheet.

[00:24:21] I gave them additional resources. Like I just said, here's how to do it basically. And nobody was, nobody does that. Right. Because I wasn't profiting off of that. Right. I had a business that was doing 60 grand a month helping financial advisors. So I was like, I don't really care. I'm want to show you guys how to do it.

[00:24:36] And I just basically like there's 10, 15 people on there. And one of them was Glen, my business partner now. Right. And I remember him at the end of the webinar being like, man, like, why are you showing us this? Like, why are you doing this? Right? And I was like, man, I just believe in the law of reciprocity that if I give so much value, it's going to come back to me in ways that I don't even know possible right now that I can't fathom.

[00:25:02] Like it may not be in direct money from you or whoever, but I know my business is going to grow or I'm going to get some sort of return in the future. By doing these good deeds and just like doing massive value just out of the goodness of my heart. So I was like, I don't really care. I want to see you guys succeed.

[00:25:18] And then three weeks later, he came back to me and he signed some clients up and then was like, yo, look what I did with your system. And I got on a zoom call with them, any systematize the shit out of it. And then was like, let me show you how I did this. And so we got on a call and then we built a relationship and then my process got better because I showed him and now he's my business partner.

[00:25:41] And we're, you know, so it's crazy how things happen, but that's how I got into helping consultants. Long story short was just giving value out of what I was doing. And then, you know, next thing you know, like these big things happen. And then I have testimonials with that first couple group. And that helped me launch my first, you know, first program.

[00:26:02] And it was really successful. So it was just by giving value with no benefit or no thought of return, I would just giving massive value. And I think that's so missed these days where you get on webinars and there's a fucking countdown, like two grand, you know, by now, like, you know, so it's like, you don't get on webinars.

[00:26:21] You don't like get on and people aren't really showing you, like had obviously got to pay for like some information, but I'm, uh, I'm just a proponent of giving so much value that they'll do business with you in the future or something good will happen to you in the future. You know,

[00:26:35] Josh: Yeah. And I mean, like, just aside from business, like that's how you met Glen, and then he's like, Hey, if you just show me this, someone that you, you would have, you would have had no idea that he would have gone and done that. He's like, Hey, here's the steps I'm going to automate it all. I think he's what using Zapier and Airtable. And now

[00:26:51] Mitch: I got on a call with them. Right. It was like two hours and he, he showed me the zaps and he was really fucking coding in Zapier. And I was like, I didn't even know you could code in Zapier. Like I don't even know what he was doing. Right. And he was basically getting like the messages from LinkedIn to fire into my CRM and then automating that like through a drip campaign email, I was like, what are you doing then?

[00:27:12] Like, how did you do this? And then he even found a better platform than I was using. Cause I was using some like server based shitty platform. And then he found a, uh, web web based, um, web app. And then we started using that one. We used that for awhile before we built our own and he showed me that and then use the whole process and just made everything so much more efficient. So yeah, it's crazy.

[00:27:35] Josh: dude. That's wild. I definitely want to get into some no-code stuff. Cause I know you've been diving into that too. Like you're a believer and you see the vision of no code for entrepreneurs. So I definitely want to get into that. But I just wanna like hammer home, like the point of like putting stuff out there, like it wasn't even just, Oh, someone will buy into like a program or something.

[00:27:52] He was like, Hey, you got something even more valuable out of that. You've got Glen as a business partner and it's like this whole idea. Um, I've had a guy on this podcast called, Sam Marfleet. Um, he taught, he calls it, um, putting up the bat signal. I call it, uh, putting nodes out in the network.

[00:28:09] Right? So like this podcast is a great example of that. You know, we're just putting stuff out value of just, you know, our experience and our philosophy strategies and tools for completely free man, like who knows what will happen. Right. But it's putting up that bat signal, people, see your bat signal that go to you.

[00:28:26] And then they'll like, again, the law of reciprocity they'll either want to return to something, a big man. Like you gave me this thing, I ran with it. I got to show you, like, I got to show you what I did with it and be like, Holy crap. Have you had any of that lately with any of your recent clients? Have you been like surprised by anything that they've come to you with? Like either new resources or maybe just their

[00:28:44] experience?

[00:28:45]Mitch: some of my clients still show me what they've got and now I'd be like, okay, well what, how are you doing that? Like, I can wait, can I model off that? Right. So like a lot of this stuff is like, um, I can, new to in particular ones are, uh, this Ramsey and Below solid guys they'll they just optimize my system.

[00:29:03] They, they went and just ran with it. They it's, it's interesting how, when you start to teach someone, but that's the thing like you were saying earlier is when you come into something, you just got to do it, that process exactly how your mentor or your advisor consultants telling you, then you can optimize and you can like, you know, create it yourself.

[00:29:22] But I'm constantly learning from even my own clients, but even the stuff we're doing, even taking things, even a step further. Like you're saying, using these other tools that like the no-code tools that like, we're now starting to see so much power in.

[00:29:39] And my partner now, like imagine having that skill set that he built up of Zapier, you can literally build anything if you know how to, you know, databases and, you know, Zapier, you can literally build anything these days. So it's pretty wild. And so I see the massive opportunities there as well.

[00:29:56] Josh: Yeah, dude. What do you kind of see? Um, opportunity-wise um, for no code, I mean, do you guys are leveraging a few, if you want to mention some of the tools that you're using, um, but maybe just more in general, cause you remember, we talk about like sort of unifying systems. You know, all these interchangeable systems now with Zapier Integromat and other automation platforms, but unifying them.

[00:30:18] So what have you seen being like the biggest opportunity in some of the tools that you've guys been using?

[00:30:23]Mitch: Yeah. Well, I mean, I don't want to give away too much of like my vision, but I will tell you kind of what we're thinking of in terms of it, because businesses, they don't have good systems in place. Even some pretty large businesses. Like we work with one company does like 21 million a year.

[00:30:43] Some of them do 8 million a month. And because some of them are even sales agencies. Right. And so they sell on behalf of clients and we see in, into their systems and even our current system is in the way we have our business systems are really dialed in compared to a lot of other companies. But the way that I see it is exactly like you're saying, we're trying to see, okay, how can we cut down the amount, the amount of tools people need, and that use and how, like you say, how can we unify them or com compress them or condense them into one main one that can do all these functions with less costs, less waste, and also talk to each other more efficiently.

[00:31:28] So you can, you know, you can just plug into it, right? So that's kind of what we're thinking of. Like these no code tools is like, you can like essentially create one place that all the data and everything is going into, and then how you display that data and how you use it to make decisions or use it to influence and get better results is kind of what we're thinking.

[00:31:52] So instead of having like spreadsheets and all this stuff, it's like, how can you use one core platform, especially for like running your business, whether it's through payments, like we have to pay commissions and payroll. And we have to, you know, we have to use 'em for prospects and sales and sales reporting and tracking and advertising. Like, how can we compress these things into like one unifying, like you said, platform that's easily displaying the data and being able to like really simplify things down. And especially on our end selling a solution like that to clients where they can literally just plug in through a few connections and bam, they have a, like, you're mentioning it a little business in a box or like a little McDonald's system, you know, franchise

[00:32:42] Josh: A little

[00:32:43] Mitch: key, you know,

[00:32:44] Josh: No, yeah, turnkey. Right. And that's what it is. I think like with everything, especially in technology, there's always like, there's times of bundling and unbundling, right. Where things are getting bundled up. You know, we saw that with like Microsoft Office. even now Google a workplace. I think they call it now.

[00:32:59] And everything being unbundled and then Zapier being the glue to like bundle it back up again. And then that's kind of allowing you to create maybe like a, an MVP version of what that new bundle will look like. It's like, Hey, this new bundle looks like these four apps all going through Zapier, but guess what?

[00:33:16] Now we can like get rid of those four apps, get rid of Zapier and here's one whole system. So I think we'll see a lot more of that. And I think, um, that's kind of what we're going with this. I'm not going to give away any more either. Cause I think I know where, where that sort of heading, um, especially with sort of your vision with that, but it really comes down to, um, the sales and marketing get into that, right.

[00:33:36] Because it's unifying all the sales and marketing tools. And I know you guys, I mean, maybe we can kind of bring this into light a little bit more, like one of the main ways that you teach your clients to get, get customers themselves is through LinkedIn, right? So using LinkedIn marketing, but then there's also Facebook ads that you guys scaled. And now you're switching over to YouTube now, YouTube ads.

[00:33:58] So maybe again to that, maybe we can talk about sort of your journey with advertising because I know a lot of your skillset and what you love to do is in the marketing and ad side, and maybe you can kind of shed some light on your journey and growth through this kind of world right now of online marketing.

[00:34:14]Mitch: I would say in terms of like marketing and sales yeah. And like going in back to like the core problems of Maine most businesses is they, they lack like, typically what I found is the front end actually generating the leads and then getting them to convert into appointments. That's really where most people struggle. And that's one of the thing I struggled with for years. Right.

[00:34:37] And so that's one thing that I solved for myself by using LinkedIn. Right. So we used LinkedIn, um, organic and we built an automation tool to automate that process. But a lot of the, a lot of the things is that we don't just use LinkedIn.

[00:34:54] We have like a multi-channel approach. I mean, this may blow some people's minds, but, we basically reaching out to them, we're building up our networks, right. I got 10,000 followers on LinkedIn and so, or connections. And so I'm reaching out to them, I'm connecting with them on building my network. Right.

[00:35:11] But when we connect with them, our software also pulls their email. Right. So we're, we're messaging them through LinkedIn and we're building relationships with our very personalized, like, because a lot of this stuff is like spam, but if you can do it right, and you have a good message and it's getting them to spark actual conversations, that's how we're like basically getting in front of them, creating conversations, then converting them into appointments.

[00:35:37] Right. So that's one of the main things I solved. Right. Which was generating appointments literally with no, no money on ads. Right. That was because I didn't have money on ads. Right. So I couldn't even spend any money on paid advertising. So I solved that problem. Right. And then it's about, not just on LinkedIn, because what we do is we also take their email and then we put them through an email campaign. So that generates additional appointments. Right.

[00:36:02] But then we also take their emails and we upload them into different platforms like Facebook and YouTube and Google display network. And we retarget them into a mechanism. What I call a pre-selling mechanism, which is essentially a video sales letter funnel to get them to apply to work with us.

[00:36:21] So now you're taking outbound and inbound and you're kind of merging them. And one of the things is too is when you just retarget, it's so much cheaper because you have the data, then if you're going to pay Facebook for the data, right. So you can get costs for like a third of the cost of traditional, like cold traffic advertising.

[00:36:39] Cause it's almost like you're uploading your email list as a retargeting list. Right. And you can create lookalike similar audiences. You could do so much with it, which that's the core system of what I built.

[00:36:50] But then we go into venturing into other areas of like doing like straight cold traffic to the funnel. And then con how do you convert cold traffic into sales, into appointments and then close them on the phone? So those are the two main systems that we use is LinkedIn outbound with the multi-channel approach. And then we use inbound through YouTube to do a lot of Facebook, but Facebook, one of our ad account or our business manager.

[00:37:14] Um, and I spent close to a million dollars on Facebook, one of our valued customer, but they don't care. So I'm just going to go to your competitor, YouTube or Google and, uh,

[00:37:25] Josh: Facebook doesn't care until you're spending like a million dollars a day. Like, I think at that point, maybe like I've a friend at Shopify. I spent like over a million a day. Um, Shopify does. And, uh, yeah, they have like a dedicated account manager then, but like they don't care, man. I I've heard, I mean, I haven't done too much.

[00:37:41] I've only done very little Facebook ads, but I do hear that their customer service is non-existent like, unless you have a dedicated

[00:37:49] Mitch: but also it's increasingly like this, it didn't just happen to me. Like I'm in a big mastermind. I know a lot of people, this happened too. Right. And they're just going trigger happy, just banning accounts and stuff. And so it, we, we had to pivot to YouTube ads, which I learned pretty quickly is similar, but I don't know if you want to dive into that a bit, but, um,

[00:38:10] but yeah, in terms of marketing and sales, like the biggest thing that you need to solve is getting appointments on the calendar. Right? If you can do that, if you can light up the calendar, then you, there's no way you won't succeed, but that's where a lot of people need help with is like, they just need to volume and they need to focus on the right types of clients that they actually are attracting. Right.

[00:38:32] So let's do the messaging and copywriting, which I'm obsessed with, like marketing, like just copywriting as well. You gotta get really good and like really laser focused and pinpoint target those people and then just feeding them onto the calendar and then getting good at selling over the phone or over Zoom.

[00:38:48]Josh: Yeah, totally. I think you hit the nail on the head there. It's like, not just getting them on the calls, but then knowing what to say to actually close them to stuff. I know you have like a pretty detailed like sales, I guess you can call it script maybe, right? Like there's specific yeah. Process, but there's like ways that you can direct people to close the deal and not in a way that's pushy.

[00:39:09] People would think that people think of it in such a weird way. Right?

[00:39:13] Mitch: I tell them not to buy sometimes. So like at the end of the day, when someone is coming to you again, they're, they're in, they're coming on the phone with you or on Zoom or whatever, or they're inquiring about your services, not even your services, they're inquiring about the result and the transformation that you can deliver.

[00:39:32] All they care about is that there's desired future. Right? And so when you switched to selling transformations and desired futures, rather than products and services like selling SaaS or doing demos and stuff like that, whatever you're selling it, it will change the game for you like when I started to like, cause when I was going through the process and, and structuring the actual script and doing

[00:39:53] Like I've literally done, probably over 4,000 - 5,000 sales calls, probably more, I learned that when you're at the end of the call, you're not, you're not closing them. You're opening the relationship,  that's a mind shift as well. You're not trying to close someone. You're trying to open the relationship and your, the one on the other side of the phone or zoom that has the quote unquote, what I like to call it, the suitcase full of money.

[00:40:21] Your the one that has the antidote or the medicine to cure them, to deliver the transformation. When you truly believe that, they're the ones that are basically selling you. And I'm saying, how are you a good fit, and you're going to be selling me. And why should I take you on as a client basically?

[00:40:42] And you kind of flip the script and now they're selling you. Right? And then you're telling about all, if you're not committed to doing this and are willing to step up to get these results, then maybe it's not a good fit, John, maybe you shouldn't I don't know. You tell me. And they're going to be like, well, no, I want to do this. Like, okay, well, how can we make this reality for you then?

[00:41:04] You know, when you're kind of just like, you're the one that's you have it. There, they need to get it from you. Right. And so a lot of people are selling people on and trying to close them, but I'm just sitting back calm, cool, collected. Like, yeah, it can get you start right now if you want. Right.

[00:41:23]Josh: Man that's such, that is a huge mind shift. That's a really good mind shift to have, I think for anyone who is doing any kind of sales, again, that could be the freelancers, consultants, whatever. But even if you have kind of SaaS whatever it is, right, they want what you have. It's not, you have to get out of the mindset first, obviously being like, Oh, I need to make this sale.

[00:41:41] It's not that it's, Hey, I have this thing that's worth way more than its weight in gold. It, then it isn't money. I think that analogy or like that visualization of like, I'm the one with the suitcase of money. They're the ones that are gonna make more money with that system or whatever it is that you're

[00:41:55] Mitch: Or you're solving anything. It could be fitness. It could be weight loss. It could be anything right. It's like, they're the ones that are, that have the problem. Right.

[00:42:04] And I think it also comes to like, the frame that you have is when you have a lot of opportunities on your calendar, like when you have like three, three calls a week or four calls a week, you're like, literally you're in a vice grip to close this person because like, Oh, I don't know if the next, like, like when you have eight back-to-back calls a day, you, you really, you know, one of them, or two of them are going to buy, you know?

[00:42:27] So I'm not worried when I'm on the phone, I'm like, so cool, calm and collected. I think that that helps a lot, if you're a sales person, if you're a business owner doing sales, like having a lot of opportunities on the, on the actual phone with people, it will lower your need. You're not the needy troubled ones.

[00:42:47] Right. They're the needy troubled one that needs your help. Right. And so when you're, cause then you're kind of like chasing after them, trying to get them to give you money. Right. Cause you need money. But when you come from that abundance state, you have a lot of opportunities and you're just coming from the frame that I can truly genuinely help you.

[00:43:06] And I know my product and service is the best product and services that are going to help you get this result because you're selling, like I said, that desired future, that transformation. And again, even with whatever you're selling, like it could be software. Don't just go into the features and benefits and all that stuff focus a lot on just like defining their two States.

[00:43:27] Right. Where are they currently at? Where do they want to go? And what's stopping them from getting there? Once you know those things. And what else have you tried? Right. Why didn't it work? Why do you need to do this now? Right. And okay, what did you want my help with? And you just kind of ask these questions.

[00:43:46] They're like, Oh, it's more of like a consultative kind of approach. And then based on what they say you're prescribing. So I don't like describing the product and service. You're prescribing it like a doctor that shift. And then coming from the frame of, I am the person with the suitcase full of money and you need it more than I need you essentially, because you have so many opportunities your demeanor on the call, it's just going to flip and you're going to actually close more deals from not being attached to the outcome.

[00:44:14]Josh: That's key. Right. Not being attached to the outcome because you don't know, like you can't like force people to do anything. Right. And I think it's a really good point. It's like, um, I think I've talked about this on the podcast before, too. It's like, um, like you said, but the prescription mindset, like the doctor mindset, you know, they're coming in with like a broken arm or something, and you're first trying to see if you can even like help

[00:44:33] Mitch: Pushing on it on the bone that's sticking out is, does that hurt? Right?

[00:44:36] Josh: yeah,

[00:44:37] Mitch: it hurts, I'm like, okay, well, this is how we're going to fix it, you know?

[00:44:41] Josh: exactly, exactly. And I think that's key and it's almost like, you know, it comes back to like anything in life or like dating, if you're like, you know, if you're like the needy one being like, Oh,

[00:44:51] like, you know, going after all the girls. Yeah. Texting back immediately. Whereas, you know, girls like the bad boys, like, Oh, like, you know, as soon as you stop caring about them, you don't care about, uh, yeah, exactly.

[00:45:03] Or as soon as like you're focusing on yourself, almost in that relationship, that's when you have people come to you. So like, how do you think about that too? When you're on like the sales calls and that sort of mindset you're thinking about yourself, um, being able to help them, right. It's like the opposite.

[00:45:18] It's like people think about it from the, the selfish sense, right. Of like myself, I need to make the sale, but really it's like thinking about how I can help them. So you're, I guess it comes into empathy, right? Like you're kind of really

[00:45:30] Mitch: Yeah. Sales is all about that man. And like empathizing and even like, I was on a call with a guy today and I, when you genuinely care, like genuinely care about their wellbeing. And like you said, you shifted off yourself, like, who cares? Like you're you're, if you're do the process, right. People will just give you money because they like you, they trust you.

[00:45:56] They CA it can sense that you care you'll automatically close deals, man. Like I genuinely care. And like, cause I just know how, how much I put into my business and how much value I create. But also the time and energy I put into it, I can sense. And I can empathize with the other person on the phone that's literally grinding. Put trying to provide for their family and their kids. Right. And there, this is not working for them so I can empathize and then I can actually go a step further because I don't even have kids. So I'm kind of imagining how, how can I be putting myself in their shoes and how they would feel right now not having this.

[00:46:36] And then I know I have the solution to their problem, not solving their problem, but positioning myself as the vehicle to help them get there. That is key. Like Soki man taking yourself out of the equation and shifting from I, to you, you know?

[00:46:53] Josh: Right. Or even like we, right. Cause like now you'd be able to commute it. Yeah. Us. Cause you built like a community of all these people. And I guess, I guess to a point, like, how do you think about, like, you're saying like, you know, you have this thing that could solve their problem, but you're not going to give it to them for free.

[00:47:06] Like, I mean, you know, it's kind of weird. It's a weird situation. Cause you're like, Hey, like I have this thing, like yeah, I can, it can definitely solve your problem. And like, Oh, I can't afford it. Or I don't know. But there's a reason why, you know, obviously people should be paying for the stuff in the first place because you know, it gets them to put skin in the game as, as the main thing.

[00:47:25] And they're actually going to succeed where there other things that you've noticed that leads to their actual outcome other than the skin in the game, obviously having to pay for this thing rather than because if you just give it to them for free, they probably wouldn't even finish the program. They would just like leave halfway through.

[00:47:38] They wouldn't do anything where there other things that you've known had pushed them over the edge to give them that outcome, to make sure that they succeed.

[00:47:47] Mitch: Yeah, they just need, like, they need a strong why. They need, like, why are they doing it? Right. That's important to also like dig into and like, cause whenever they have something that's bigger than them, like their family or like they need to do this for some, like an outcome that they really want. That's like their vision. I find that also helps.

[00:48:06] But then, um, in terms of like actually getting results yeah, sheer hunger, and then also having a why hunger and accountability is key. Sowe even indoctrinate that a lot into like the actual program with my client success manager, Jeff, you know, Jeff and, uh,

[00:48:26] putting accountability in, in terms of like the first initial stages to build momentum. I think that helps a lot. And then also when they get in the community, pair up with an accountability partner. So I even see a lot of, um, like there's like these older guys, like 60, 50 year old, they were on my live call and then they took it offline and they started building a relationship offline. And then even though, like, I didn't think those two guys would ever like actually become partners.

[00:48:52] Like they, they, they formed a relationship. Right. And then they can go through it together and kind of talk it through. And so that's also important. But in terms of like, even on the sales call, I don't know if you're asking that. yeah. You also showing them on the, the a lot of times I'll give you some gyms on the, for a sales conversation is.

[00:49:09] The opposite if they do the opposite of, so I'll give you an example. You're kind of what I, what we call like negative reverse sell. So what if you don't do this, what's going to happen then? What if you continue doing X, Y, and Z, what you just told me throughout the call, how's that going to help you? Or how's that going to get you to your goal?

[00:49:35] And they're going to say, it's not. Exactly. So how can make this a reality or how can we, how can we move forward to help you to deliver the transformation or get you where you want to go and like using the rewards. Right. So I think that's an, also another key, but that's what I found

[00:49:50]Josh: so have you, how have you guys been able to bring that into the community, the community aspect of it? Right. Cause obviously like, you know, you can have like one sour, Apple ruined the whole batch. Right. So how do you make sure that you guys have a great culture and community in there?

[00:50:04] Cause that's a big part of it. Right? It's like all these people are gonna start asking each other questions and adding stuff. How have you guys been able to foster the community? Especially like remotely, like the whole thing is obviously remote. Um, it's not like there's like a live events or like an office people go to. Right. So how do you guys foster that

[00:50:20]Mitch: in terms of community, it's all about the people that you let in as well. So like there's a lot of times where. Again, if someone were to like start being frantic and sort of messing with the community or like start being negative, I'll probably just refund them. I don't like, we've done that before.

[00:50:40] Like, I don't even want you in the program. I don't care who you are. If you're messing with the community and you're causing other people, you know, mental trouble you're causing our team to have spend time on it and stuff. I'm not, I don't, I don't even really care, but sometimes those workout where you kind of have to talk to them on the live calls and kind of work it out, but we don't have, we've had, hadn't really had a big issue with that.

[00:51:01] But in terms of fostering community, one guarding the gates, making sure you're actually selling the right people into it. Right.

[00:51:08] Josh: comes back down to the sales, right? Making sure like you're

[00:51:10] Mitch: guarding the Gates. Right. I don't want just anyone to buy.

[00:51:13] Josh: yeah. They're selling you on why they should let you into the Gates.

[00:51:16] Mitch: Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And more than that, just letting the right people through. Right. Even if you can sell them, like, okay, would this person really be a good fit?

[00:51:25] Um, and then

[00:51:26] Josh: Has there been a time where you had to like turn people away?

[00:51:30] Mitch: yeah.

[00:51:31] Josh: Really? What was that? Like? What was

[00:51:33] Mitch: I cancel calls all the time too? Cause I just can't help you. Right. And I'll even tell them like, yeah, on the phone, like, it doesn't seem like this would be a good fit. And they're like, well, what do you mean? Right. And they try and sell you back, but I just literally have to push them away because it's just certain types of business models.

[00:51:48] It's not necessarily like the person necessarily. Um, but there has been times where I was like, this guy's a Dick. I don't want you in the fro. I wouldn't even take your money.

[00:51:56] Josh: Right. Yeah. That's

[00:51:57] Mitch: make, yeah. You know, they, they, they have the ego and this, I don't even want that in, but in terms of fostering the community, it's yeah.

[00:52:07] Just letting the right people in and then also stimulating it, I think with like, and having sort of like cultural norm, not norms, but like we have something called like booms, right. When they get a sale or when they, when they have a good outcome, they post a boom. Right. And we have like a, like people celebrate and they post images and gifs and all that stuff in is cool.

[00:52:28] Right. When people get results. And then in terms of like other things, like a lot of things that we started to implement now was the accountability. I think that's key because people, especially in programs, there's so many other things that you could be doing, right. You could literally be, go walk your dog.

[00:52:45] You could, you know, you may have to go make dinner. Like once you have accountability and then you're also coming to a structured kind of set of calls. Also, it helps a lot with just like building that momentum and keeping that momentum. They're building that habit, right?

[00:52:59]Josh: That's key, it's building the habit, but also like, um, we can get into this now is the mindset training that you've like embedded into your program. And that's obviously, you know, an Amash or whatever and influence from, from Sam and, and from Consulting.

[00:53:15] And I've heard a lot of people do that. I've had Marie Poulin on here. She does Notion Mastery. And so many people have been saying like, Oh, like I thought I was just going to learn Notion. I thought I was just gonna learn this tool, but then like, I'm learning like personal development as well. Like what is this? And it's like, you know, it's like, you know, it's like the Trojan horse or like, you know, sneaking in the vegetables, you know, into the meal, like where they don't even know.

[00:53:37] So yeah, let's get into the mindset map because I think that's a big part of it too. Right. I'm sure like there's habit forming habit building, but like before you even get into teaching people how to use tools or systems, you're like trying to get them foundational mindset stuff to, to almost indoctrinate them into the same kind of mindset and a growth mindset.

[00:53:55] So yeah. Tell me a little bit about that and sort of maybe high level, what you add in there and what you're trying to achieve to get them to

[00:54:01] do

[00:54:02] Mitch: sure. And what we can do, Josh is I actually, um, I posted a, uh, I leaked one of my modules called structure formation, and it's all about building habits and I give you tools. I give you my day planner that you can print out. I'll give you some other tools as well. It's pretty long training, but it's going to go into a lot of depth in that.

[00:54:20] I think we can link it in somewhere on the podcast as well. Someone could check it

[00:54:24] Josh: for sure. Is on YouTube.

[00:54:26] Mitch: It's on YouTube, but also send you the link and you can add it as well. It's on our blog too.

[00:54:31] Josh: Okay. Perfect. Yeah. So anyone listening, I'll put the link in the description, there'll be in the show notes most likely. So if you don't see it in the description of this podcast or on YouTube, click through to the show notes and it will be in there for sure.

[00:54:41] Mitch: Yeah, but in terms of mindset, like that's a big thing. Like the very first thing I get people to do. Well, the second thing is I get them to structure up their schedule, to block out the time to actually invest the time into it. Right. And prioritize it because you're whatever you're like, whatever your results you're seeing, like are just a dictated based on the priorities that you have.

[00:55:06] Right. And actually the priority, if you look at the root definition of what actually priority means, it means one thing basically, right? And this new way of priorities is now multiple one thing, you know? And so when you have a priority as like making this program a priority, right.

[00:55:26] And so I get them to structure it out and then also forming good habits, like revenue generating habits, like what are you doing everyday to move the boat for, to generate appointments, to get leads, to get sales, right, building those in there, and then structuring their, their, their life in a way where they can actually free up time for their business, but also their personal life.

[00:55:47] So I go into a lot, like that's the first thing I do is structuring habits, routines, um, establishing tools and things that they can actually focus and starving distractions. Like first thing I get them to do get Newsfeed Eradicator, which removes your Facebook newsfeed, remove recommendations on YouTube. Like get all these tools to like free up your time so you can focus. Right. First thing I do.

[00:56:12] But in terms of mindset, I look at it a little bit differently. Um, I think of it more as like high-performance how to become like a high-performance entrepreneur. Right. And definitely mindset is like a broad term in, in, in that, but becoming high performance in the terms of like your

[00:56:32] cause I hired a high performance coach, right. For a few months, like nine months. And I was working with him and we optimize sleep. Nobody really talks about that really, really optimizing sleep using, ordering, tracking your sleep, making sure that you have a deep downtime. So you go to bed early, you're getting into that state. Right. And then optimizing your nutrition, optimizing your workouts, optimizing like your health embodied into that.

[00:56:59] And then also in terms of, you know, getting into the state where, um, especially when you're doing sales or even just business, you need to get in a good state. So having good morning routines having a, again, just structure to your days and how do you actually basically become a high-performance it's not just mindset.

[00:57:17] I would say there is some things that you need to change subconsciously with how you see yourself, your identity, and just formulating this new version of yourself that you can step into. That's also going to help you elevate because you've, you've heard the term of like, it's like a thermostat, right?

[00:57:35] And you, you go up to a certain level and then it goes right back down and you kind of oscillate between these two extremes. Right? And so when, when you're going up to the peak, there's something that's built into your cybernetic mechanism. That's gonna oscillate it back down to your, your low point. And then when it gets there, you're going to kick back in gear and you're going to start to go rise above your high point.

[00:57:57] And so,

[00:57:58]Josh: Right. Yeah. That's like the thermometer. So it's like, yeah, what I've heard is like, you want to be a thermostat, not a thermometer. Right. Thermometer does exactly what you're saying. Like it, it just reacts to the,

[00:58:08] Mitch: no, but even a thermostat. Right? Like I see it

[00:58:10] Josh: but thermostat you set the whole point is that you set your thermostat. So like, I think of like the nest, like I'm going to go to like 70 degrees set it yourself.

[00:58:17] Instead of being a thermometer, I was like, Oh, it's getting hot in here. Like, Oh, let's

[00:58:20] rise. Let's go back down.

[00:58:21] Mitch: yeah.

[00:58:22] But one of the things too is like, when, when you're going up to that level, that's what I was saying with they get new identity is like your, your, your high point may be 72 and your low might be like 67. Right. But how can you get to like 90, right. Again, you need to set it and you need to step into this new version of yourself and then being able to oscillate at a higher level and operate at nineties and consistently over a period of time and winners, the ones that actually like, I don't want, you can coin that term.

[00:58:53] Winners are like high performance individuals that you'd be like athletes. They just sustain that level of performance through anything they're just like ruthlessly consistent. Right. And so I talk a lot about that and, uh, and then also like one thing that I think that I put in there, and maybe it's a, maybe it's overkill, but Metta learning at call it a, well, the unified field theory, right.

[00:59:18] Meta learning, learning how to learn. Right. So in today's day and age, it's not just about learning, it's learning how to learn and how to like take the information and apply it to a high level, you know? And so, especially with reading and consuming course content or whatever, it's how are you actually optimizing that for the highest output from the time you put in?

[00:59:42] So talk a lot about that too. And, and, uh, it's helped me a lot learning how to learn and, you know, emptying my cup so I can fill it back up.

[00:59:50]Josh: Yes. Okay. So there's a couple things I want to get near. There's sort of three things in my mind. I'm going to try to get these in, in a, in a good order so we can get through them. huh, which one of those three do I want to go? This is like one of those time times where things branch out. Right. And this is, this is what I love about the human mind and through conversation where things just really start like branching out. Cause there's like sort of like three prongs here.

[01:00:09] Um, the one would actually, I want to get into first is sort of actually character and stepping into character first because I know you've done that consciously.

[01:00:18] And a lot of people don't think about this. Um, maybe you can even tell the story of, uh, the burning of the blanket and those kinds of things and like these, I think it's a great story for, for people to understand it. Um, cause I think it's, I think that kind of sums up everything. Right.

[01:00:34] And I was just reading a book today is a good brand new book came out from Jen Sincero. She wrote, um, like you're a badass and badass at making money. She just had a new book out now called, um, bad-ass habits, something like that. So I was reading like the Blinkist version and she, that was a big part of the book. She's like, you know, you have to be the type of person that does X, like you have to become that person.

[01:00:56] Um, which is something that I keep hearing reverberated. Like this is also in Atomic Habits. Like James clear talks about it. It's like to really have these high performance habits or whatever habit you want. You have to be that person. So maybe you can talk about the burning of the blanket story, and then we can, uh, get into

[01:01:12] Mitch: yeah, yeah. So, absolutely man, like I had to conscious like, especially when you're like starting out in, no, it's just for like starting out, but I think anytime you want to create massive breakthroughs or changes in your life, you need to change who you are. Right. And not like your true like self, like who are you? It's like your self image, more of like what's built up from society from like, you know, everything from your

[01:01:38] Josh: your character in this

[01:01:39] Mitch: Yeah. Your character. And I literally look at it like, you know, we used to play grand theft auto when we were a kid and you know, you can customize a character. And, you know, go in the world, whatever.

[01:01:49] But the same thing is like, you can create that character, which I think is very powerful. And I, I consciously did that and that was obviously some other help from what I learned from like Sam and some other, um, from books like uh Psycho-Cybernetics. uh, Tony Robbins also talks about it too.

[01:02:04] And, um, one of the things that go into your, into the story was when me and you, when we were living back at our childhood home, right, there's, there's an, a, this can relate into everyone's life. But I think there's a lot of like things that people carry with them that when you have that thing, it's attached to an old identity, for example, old trophies, they attach to you all the good old days, and you're attached to this old person that you were back in the day, you know?

[01:02:36] And then there's also like other things in your environment, like old clothes. That's why it's good to sometimes purge it, donate it, and then re upgrade your, your environments, your like, feel like a different person even, right. Cause there's a lot of your physiology and how you look and all that stuff as well.

[01:02:52] Um, but one of the things was when we were living at our childhood home, we were about to move and I was also in a state of like, I was changing. And now it's growing and evolving, but I had these things that like, I used to have this blanket in, that Josh was talking about, I used to sleep with, and I never really tell people a lot about it, but whatever.

[01:03:15] And it was like attached to this like little kid, right. The kids walk around with it and shit, like I had to tell, I was like 17 or whatever. Right. So then like when I was like 18, I fucking went to the backyard and I poured gasoline and I lit it on fire, almost like a signaling, like a Phoenix. And I'm rising from the burnt ashes, you know, like literally I was like a ceremony.

[01:03:43] I'm literally becoming a new person. Right. And like, sometimes you let it, you literally have to burn shit to, to become this new version. I have that in the program too, is like talking about the Phoenix and like every day, a Phoenix burns itself to the ashes and it's born a new right. And so I feel like a lot of people, they, they have certain things in their environment, like old clothes or things that they attach to this old identity that you need to kind of burn literally to the ashes and kind of create something, a new and that's something.

[01:04:13] And I've experimented with this because before, like long when I was creating the program and talking about this inside of the program and creating that character and building it into yourself and then, you know, creating this new person, I was also producing music. Right. And I wanted to produce, like, I just liked music and I liked it.

[01:04:35] Making beats or the thought of making beats, but at the same thing as like, okay, well let me apply this to this. Right? What makes you, I use this example the time. What makes it, what makes you, uh, say you want to become a world-class pianist or I'll give you an example of my case. Let's say I wanted to become a music producer.

[01:04:55] What does a music producer do? They make music, right? And so if I just make music, then I'm technically a producer. Right? So you have to think, think about who you want to become. You have to actually be them now. Right. Then you have to do it and then you'll have, or actually become it. Right. So it's like, think be, do have, right.

[01:05:20] And so once you have that kind of framework, you think about who you want to become. You be them now. Right? So I am a producer. Okay. Well, what does a producer do? They make music? So I went and downloaded logic. Then I went on YouTube and I started making music. Then I made a beat. Right. So I did it. And then I had it, which was a produced song.

[01:05:41] Or I, now I became it. Right. Well, I'm now a producer technically. And then over time you just had that feedback loop that you thought, Oh, well maybe I am a good producer. Then you start doing it again. And again, and again, then you start showing other people, okay, here's my beats. And they're like, Oh wow.

[01:05:57] You're, you're actually good. And then that reinforces that belief. In yourself and who you're becoming. And then next thing you know, it's just like a self-fulfilling positive, self-fulfilling prophecy. And then next thing you know, maybe I make a song with Drake or something who knows. Right. But like, it could happen.

[01:06:14] Right. It's because you're constantly doing, and then if you stick at it long enough, that becomes like a part of your identity.

[01:06:19] Josh: Yeah, man. That's so powerful. I hope people take something away from that. Or at least like, maybe I'm sure there's people were listening to this real, like I had no idea what to do, do not think about that at all. I was just like, Holy shit. Like, wait, what? It's so true. If you want to change your character, you have to become that character.

[01:06:33] Mitch: the first thing about it. I think, who do you want to become? Right. And what you want. Right. I think that's important. I think you have to really think about who you want to become and really like the vision and how you will feel and everything that that's not more so about how you will look like those are just like material things like in the world.

[01:06:51] Right. But like, think about, introspecting like, think about who you want to actually become in terms of how you feel, how you're interacting with others, your life, your vision, like, think about that. Right. And then who do you need to become to achieve that? Right? Say you want to become a billionaire or let's say a tech founder, think about what do these people do, you know, like who are they?

[01:07:18] And then start to adopt those character traits and kind of formulate them into who you are and then actually do it and be it. And then you actually become it. Which I think is

[01:07:27] Josh: Totally. But you have to, I think this there's a fine line between actually becoming it and then pulling a Theranos. What the fuck was that? The founder of Theranos that woman, whatever her name was, I'll put it in the show notes, but there were notes was that company right. That made, um, it was basically like a blood testing kit and they said that from one drop of blood, they can test for everything like cancer, like everything.

[01:07:50] So this woman wanted to be at this tech founder. She was like 19 and she, uh, she dropped out of school and she's like, I'm going to be like Steve jobs. She literally like dropped her voice down and should wear black total next to your talk like this. Because she wanted it to be like a bad and then every, so often it would come back up.

[01:08:06] Like, I'm pretty sure she, she made her voice even deeper than mine. And, but the point was like, she became a phony, like she was fake. So like, I think a lot of people will have like, I mean that you don't want to be, that's literally, that is fraud. That's straight up fraud, but people do have imposter syndRoam.

[01:08:21] Right. So, yeah. So let's bring it back to the other way. People do have imposter syndRoam, like, Oh, I'm not good enough, or I'm trying to do this or whatever. And I was just talking to Mark Metrie on this, the episode right before this, uh, they just posted on Monday.

[01:08:35] And it's why it's so fresh in my mind. Cause we were talking about feedback loops. A lot of people who have social anxiety or anxiety, they're not getting the correct feedback loop. So when you're going through this, it's a feedback loop process that you're saying think, feel, do, and have. Right. What I probably yeah. Think be, do have, yeah, I totally messed it up, but same principle, right?

[01:08:54] Like it's, it becomes a feedback loop is like a cycle that keeps going through.

[01:08:58] Mitch: well, at the beginning, you, it's not strengthened, right? It's it's like a, it's a figment in your imagination,

[01:09:05] Josh: Yeah. So how do you start strengthening that

[01:09:07] Mitch: Through feedback loops, tight feedback loops. Right.

[01:09:10] Josh: and how do you get those feedback loops? Yeah.

[01:09:12] Mitch: like for example, putting, putting yourself out there in a sense where, like, not only it makes it more real, right.

[01:09:20] Where now you're become like, and then for example, when I was saying that I was showing people my beats, then they're like, it gave me positive feedback. Cause like, even if it wasn't that great, they were like, Oh, that's pretty good. You know, that gave me the feedback to then feed it back into my thoughts of, well, maybe I am a good producer or maybe I can actually do this.

[01:09:40] And then you kind of refine it and you keep doing that process and it just kind of builds up again, that self fulfilling prophecy in the positive direction. Right. At the beginning, any time you're going to think like, Oh, I'm not really this, but you need to need to show up every day as if you are that.

[01:09:58] So there's that, that, there's a fine line of like actually being it, but then you got to acting as if you are okay. Yeah.

[01:10:07] Josh: Totally. And I think like what a lot of people forget is like, if we look at any of the greats, like whether it's like a great athlete, they're like an actor, especially actors in the sense, musicians, filmmakers, great artists. Like they weren't, at one point we were all born a fucking potato coming out of our parents.

[01:10:26] You know, we're not our parents coming out of our mother's womb. We were all a fucking potato. We were nothing. We were just piece of clay, the soft clay. And what I think is so cool about this whole character thing, it's like, you become the artist as well. You're chiseling away, and becoming this.

[01:10:40] I think like the best thing for me, I talked about this before is like, from my physicality too. Like I there's one, the one reason why I'm actually so consistent with like working out and being physical, I never was, you know, who I was, I was like this scrawny little musician kid. I was like that artist, you know, whatever. But I took that artist mindset of like, okay, now the next piece of work I work on is going to be myself.

[01:11:02] I'm going to literally like sculpt my body. And I had just like this here's one split moment that right after that moment, I was like, I became that person. I was a K I know I'm an artist. I can do this too. I've created things on paper, on other mediums, 3d. I could do all my own body. And like, you're becoming literally like a reality shifter.

[01:11:20] So when you become like a reality artists, people are just doing that on, on different, um, different scales, like look at Elon Musk and what he's doing with like space X and Tesla. Like they're making that a reality. It's like, you are like molding the world, find the pieces, combining the pieces, but it starts with your own self.

[01:11:36] Right. It's

[01:11:37] Mitch: Everything starts with you, right. And it's interesting. Yeah. Seeing you working out consistently and, just, uh, the way that you've kind of transformed as well. It's interesting. But I think the thing too, man, is like you're saying is separating the two States or like understanding that who like you, who you are like, who's listening to it right now and who I'm talking, I'm just pulling the strings of my body and dictating what my character does.

[01:12:07] You know? So like having almost like a third party perspective on yourself, which is interesting to, to kind of comprehend or like, think about, but you're almost like the strings, right?

[01:12:19] Josh: dude, it's so true. Like literally, literally again, I brought this up in the last episode, Mark Metry and I'll bring this up to you. Cause I don't think I ever told you about it. literally that we were talking about like seeing yourself in third person.

[01:12:29] And I remember specifically when I was in like, fuck man, third, fourth, maybe fifth grade, pretty young. I remember going for a bike ride with my friend, Andrew at the time. And we're around Ajax where we grew up and I remember. We were like, we were pretty young. You're not really supposed to leave like your street, but I remember we were on our bike.

[01:12:47] I'm like, let's just go for a long bike ride. Let's see how far we can push it. Like, let's just push our reality. Right. When you're really young, you're used to going in the car with your parents to go out of town or whatever. So we're in like the small town, we start riding our bike up to Harwood where the bridges going over the highway, the four Oh one highway.

[01:13:04] I had a specific moment first time in my life, I think where had like, sort of an awakening moment where I was riding my bike. And then all of a sudden my perspective shift above my body. And I was like three or four stories above my body. Just watching myself on my bike and seeing Andrew there too. And just seeing myself in this world.

[01:13:23] And it's so metaphorical, right. Of like pushing the limits of reality. Like this is like level one level one where you grow up in your little town. And I remember just seeing myself there. Yeah. Breaking barriers. And I was like, Holy shit. Like this is, it was so Oh, weird. And it was such a strange phenomenon that now I think about it.

[01:13:41] Uh, and obviously there's been crazier experiences after that, you know, after experimenting with psychedelics and things like that, of course, I'm going to be breaking the barrier even further, but it's stuff like that where like, you know, you start seeing yourself differently. What was that for you, man?

[01:13:55] What was your like awakening moment? Cause obviously you and I were just kids from like normal family. Our parents aren't like woke by any means. I mean, they are kind of like now I feel like everyone's starting to wake up from stuff on the internet. Yeah. Yeah. She's like a spiritual, uh, you know, Yogi. So I'll have her on the podcast one time too. Maybe we'll both do it.

[01:14:14] Mitch: yeah. I don't know if there was like a spiritual awakening for me necessarily. I think it was just realizing who the fuck I was. Like, I think so many people like ha again, like have society or people telling them who they are. And like, you start to like build up this identity of who you are. But I think when I, cause I took a totally different route from like w even the route you went through with everyone went through and like, I was just kind of in my own space, in the basement alone with my thoughts.

[01:14:51] And I had to create who I, who I wanted to become, you know, from like I needed to basically set a new standard for myself and, uh, step into that. And I think it was in the last years when I was playing hockey, I think that really helped me realize that because it showed me that I was, again, I want to use like that, like, you're a winner, but I was like a winner in my mind.

[01:15:20] Like, I'm, I'm a fucking winner. Like I'm a, I'm the top class. And I know that I'm different from every like everyone else,

[01:15:28] Josh: yeah, I kind of wanted to bring that up. Right. It was like, that was kind of my other part of this, uh, the branching of the mindset it's like, and you just brought it up. It's like, cause you played rep hockey and you did so much. And you were like a winner.

[01:15:41] Is that what gave you that winning mindset is like, you know, growing up, playing sports competitively, do you think that was one of the things that really

[01:15:50] Mitch: a hundred percent, but it fucked me up because I was playing such a high level hockey and then I got cut and it fucked with my confidence. Right. So I was like, then I got into other shit in, in high school, obviously, you know? Right. So it was like, I, it wasn't until like the last two years of when I was playing, when I was like, just before we got out of high school, that I started to win a lot and I started to just not give a fuck what anyone thought of me.

[01:16:17] And I was like, I'm winning no matter what. And I'm going to, I'm going to try her hardest. Fuck. Because in hockey world, like when I was playing, like everyone call you like a try-hard or you, you know, if you try hard, it's like, well, now I'm like, why w why was that ever a thing of limitation in my mind?

[01:16:34] You know, it's like I was playing AAA highest level, but then when I, and I was trying hard as fuck, I was like, I'm trying to beat everyone. Right. But then when I got cut from that, and I just had to build it back up, it wasn't until the last couple of years when I started, like, it was almost like a switch in my mind, like, fuck everything.

[01:16:50] I'm winning, no matter what. And then I guess that carried into, like, when I got out of that, like, I won't settle for anything less than my highest potential. And my actualize self, you know, I was like, I'm not settling for being mediocre. I'm not settling for just scraping by or whatever is like, I want to succeed the highest level.

[01:17:12] Like, why can't I. Make a hundred million or be a billionaire, like why can't I, you know, it's like, if, if, if them, if these people can do it, why not meet? And so it was like that kind of, I guess, fire, or like this spark inside of me. And then it just kinda like once you have that spark, just kindling that fire, I think, and then over time, it just kind of, you just start, you know, waffing the fire and, you know, putting, you know, making it bigger and bigger, bigger, and then putting gasoline on it.

[01:17:43] And just like you just start to build up this, um, like a positive self image and a positive, you know, view of who you are and just like tapping into that, I guess the core of really who you are, because there's another side of what we were talking about creating the identity, but then tapping into your core.

[01:17:59] I think when you kind of merge those two or those two connect, I think that's a really powerful thing where you're not afraid of being that person that can truly be it. Cause that's actually truly you, because if you really do the exercise of thinking and like, introspecting, you will know who you are intrinsically to then use that as fuel and motivation, intrinsic motivation to actually, you know, step into that.

[01:18:23] And I think that's important to like also determine too, or like as mentioned is that when going inside, you're going to pull out that, that tiny little thread or that seed that you can sort of pull or water and kind of start to build upon. And then that's kind of for me. And then I think just sitting with my thoughts a lot.

[01:18:43] And I think one of the biggest transformations I've ever had any time I have massive breakthroughs is when I asked myself hard, hard, dark question, not dark question, but hard questions where I S when I sit with myself,

[01:18:59] sit with myself and like, I remember one time in particular, I was just sitting with myself, uh, because when I, when I, especially like, when here, when I was coming up, like all my friends were like still drinking and like, people are smoking weed and all that stuff.

[01:19:14] And so I had to sit down sometimes in myself and just be like, why am I still doing this? When I know I shouldn't be doing this. Right. And like, sitting with myself, asking like deep questions, or even like recently, it's like really sitting down and asking, um, like, w w what is preventing me? Like, what am I doing to stop myself from getting to this next level?

[01:19:37] Like, kind of going inside yourself and like sitting down in like a quiet solitude space and just asking yourself hard questions, maybe pulling out a notepad, writing down things of like, that you're doing that, you know, you shouldn't be doing. And like, just kind of identifying and being really hyper self-aware of them.

[01:19:55] I think, like, that's extremely important to like, meditate on those things, because anytime I've done that, man, like I've had some massive breakthroughs where I just knew what I shouldn't be doing, and I knew I should have been doing. And then also like, Just creating a system to fix it. Right. And then systematically like build the habit back up so that I don't make those mistakes of self-sabotaging or building myself back down.

[01:20:25] Because again, it's like the thermostat you're kind of oscillating. And if you can be aware of it, then you can cost you to keep going up. And like what I call like momentum stacking it like momentum stacking, where you're kind of ink, ink, increasingly growing up those S curves and stacking the S curves.

[01:20:42] And that's what creates that exponential growth. But it's through like introspection, I think really sitting down. Cause no one's going to do that for you,

[01:20:50] Josh: No, you're right. I think there's like, dude, there's like only two ways. Um, I'm going to see if I can get this right. This might take me a while to bring back up, but it was, um, it actually learned this from, from Vishen, from, uh, Mind Valley and there's like two ways. Um, there's, there's, they're Japanese terms.

[01:21:07] I'm going to see if I can remember what they were. Um, what brought up brought up, brought up for me was the stacking of the S curves, right? It's like you're forcing yourself to level up all the time. Otherwise the only other way to level up and get that exponential curve is you're kind of going up small. Then you have a big crash, you have a traumatic event, you have something that just like destroys you.

[01:21:30] And then you, you just like come right back out of that. Hit rock bottom, you hit a dip and you go up. I will try to remember the terms of this out either. I'll let you know, I'll put it in the link in the description, but,

[01:21:42] Mitch: But you don't need to get to that point, right? Like you don't know, most people don't need to get to that point. Right. I think like what I was explaining there with like these S-curves, it's being self aware of when you are going down right.

[01:21:56] Josh: I also just remembered what it was. Thank God for Notion, because I wanted to bring something up here. But these two terms I was thinking of, and I learned it from, from Vishen in one of his courses, it's Satori and Kensho. So I think this is a great way. Now I can remember like the terms I'm going to like embed this in my brain.

[01:22:14] I might even do like a visualized value type of like fucking graphic of the stuff. Shout out to Jack Butcher there. But it's exactly that you have, you have Ken show and you have Satori and you want to embrace the Satories. Satori is what you talked about. I guess we can think of Satori, like the S curves, right?

[01:22:28] So it's like S curve Satori, S curve S curve. And you do that through constant meditation of like going inward, doing courses, doing, um, self-development like every single day learning new things. Otherwise you're going through Kensho. Kensho is that like that dip, right? You go through rock bottom, you go through a traumatic event and then you fucking level up.

[01:22:50] For me, I had one of those. Um, one time I got really, really drunk at my friend is, and I literally took like the biggest bong hit. Of my life and passed out, just Kao, smashed my face on the pavement in his backyard. And I remember waking up in a pool of blood and like my tooth, like hanging out, you can even see now you're on video. It's like a little bit darker still.

[01:23:19] And just like waking up from that, right. You have like this awakening moment. I'm like, Holy shit, what am I doing? Like, you can't do this. Like, what happens if you keep doing this? Like, you can't have that happen again. It could be a lot worse. Right.

[01:23:29] So you want to, then I think it was right after that moment where like, you know, after I went to university and stuff, I started to embrace this sort of like Satori mindset of like, I don't know how I got into it, man.

[01:23:40] Do you remember how you even got into it? Like how, like, look, you and I both have stacks of books. Like we were not big readers growing up. Like you were playing hockey. I was playing music. We were fucking stoners, basically. Like we share, we consciously chose to choose this lifestyle. I don't know how we both kind of fell into it, but

[01:23:57] Mitch: Yeah. I think, I think we both had, uh, uh, Ken, Ken Shaw. I think we both had some of those moments, like where, and I think people ness, I think they need to have some of those moments where it lifer God kind of slaps you in, in kind of directs you in the right way or kind of wakes you up. I think people, some people need that because otherwise they just are on this like constant, like, like.

[01:24:25] Uh, equilibrium point. They never like go down too far where they're like, fuck that. That's way below my limit of standard of what I feel, what I can accept in myself. I think that's where it comes down to is when you go so low, when you breach your low point, like if you think about a thermostat, like a high and a low, and the equilibrium, you kind of breached that.

[01:24:46] And you're like, this was like in the negatives, like I can not be fucking doing this the rest of my life. And I think when it goes dip, so that low, you have like that point where you're just like, okay, let me just, you know, then catch myself when I'm going on the downward spiral and like against it stacking those S-curves.

[01:25:02] And I've had like, I don't know if you want to go into that, but I've had instances where I probably would have went to like, probably at the time juvenile detention or like jail, because I was doing some illegal activities and when I was younger and so that woke me the fuck up because I was like, if I continue to do that then, and traffic, marijuana and all this stuff, then I'm obviously not going to end up in where I want to be. And so that kind of woke me up.

[01:25:32] Josh: Well, luckily it wasn't anything too bad and you make it sound like you're dealing with like meth or something. It's just, we don't worry. You would have been an essential worker a lot the

[01:25:39] Mitch: yeah. These days. But when I, when I was doing it, I would have, I would probably would've got logged in for like five years.

[01:25:44] Josh: I know. It's weird how that works now it's the central service you can get on every corner in the city. It's so

[01:25:49] Mitch: Yeah, but I was also just like who I was at the time two men, I was also dealing with the wrong types of people. Like I probably could have got into like all

[01:25:55] Josh: Yeah. Yeah. There's some shady fucks man, but

[01:25:58] Mitch: Yeah.

[01:25:59] Josh: like, that's so

[01:26:00] Mitch: But I did it more as like the entrepreneur. I was more of an entrepreneur to me.

[01:26:03] Josh: Yeah. Yeah. And that was maybe one of your first, other than like paper, route. I don't know. It's still kind of entrepreneurial, but maybe that was your first like kind of

[01:26:10] Mitch: Yeah. I saw, I saw a problem. I saw a need in the market and I feel that inefficiency.

[01:26:16] Josh: Okay. Exactly. Exactly. But man, I think like the thing is between that and sort of like this new age entrepreneurship, I think just the timing wise, like you mentioned the, um, the iconic here, my garage video, and that was one of the things that kind of, that was one of the doors that opened you up to like new age entrepreneurship too.

[01:26:35] Cause that's what else? So then, you know, introduce you to Sam and stuff like that, which is so funny because that's like, the people are trying to sell this dream. Right. And people kind of talk shit about it, but sometimes you need the dream to be sold to you. Maybe even get scammed a couple of times before you're like, wait, like there was something here though.

[01:26:53] It's like, yeah, I got scammed. But like maybe I do want this life. I want something like Ty Lopez. Sure. For whatever flack, he guests that video went viral and stuff, but he had more, more kids reading books than anybody else. Like it was crazy. It's in the game. I don't know how he did it. Right. So it's things like that.

[01:27:08] Was he one of the influences that got you into reading and then after that, you kind of, you're like you're flying on your own, right? He like, it's a paper airplane. He throws it and then you're, you're on your own.

[01:27:17] Mitch: Exactly. No, he, he definitely attracted me too. I mean, I was reading and I had, this is funny because I had one of those moments when I was like 17. I, YouTube was still fairly young back then. And I watched this one video and it was like one of those, like, I wouldn't say motivational, but it was more of like a mini kind of like documentary style where the guy was like, commentating over like drone shots of a beach.

[01:27:46] And like out of nowhere, like explaining like how you can ha like tapping into yourself and stuff. So that was like, it got my mind, like wondering, like, you know, like, do I really want to go this route that all my classmates and everyone are going down and I was like, no. Right. And then I was in that, that summer I had to do landscaping.

[01:28:05] I was fucking laying brick all day, breathing in concrete from cutting the bricks and stuff. And I was like, I know right now I'm never doing this shit again in my life. And then I kind of then tie, probably hitting you with an ad. And then I started reading books. And then I kind of actually, I think the first thing I got into was trading Forex.

[01:28:24] So that got me into like, and then my mentor there, he helped me start reading books and getting into that. Then I think Ty hit me with an ad and then, um, but yeah, once you, you kinda need something to like compel you or someone. Yeah, like you said, you gotta, you gotta be willing to invest in yourself.

[01:28:47] Even if like I invest a fuck ton of money in myself, I probably spend a hundred grand a year nowadays on, on masterminds and mentorship, way more, probably spent way more than someone would spend on college on my own meant like education. And that's because like, I'm trying to level up, man. Like, I'm trying to get it.

[01:29:08] Not even just with mentors, but you get access to people that are way beyond you in what you're doing. And like, once you get into those upper echelon of players, then you start to have different conversations and they say this all the time, you're the summation of the five people you hang around with.

[01:29:25] Right. You can actually get access and basically buy access to different people or mentors that are way ahead of you to like, like I think Sam or cut my probably learning curve by probably 20 years, probably more. Right. Because I, and then just the sheer level of hours I put into it also helps me compress the time.

[01:29:46] And that's why I look a lot of like compressing and by leveling up spending money and investing in myself, man, like it's so critical. And again, there were some questionable courses I bought earlier on where I was like, well, I probably, this was a fucking scam, but who cares? I just kind of kept moving on. What am I going to do about it? You know, kept investing in myself, kept in, you know, doing other things. But yes, I have to be a good judgment of. Character in like finding good people and, and then, you know, can like find successful people and figure out what they did and model off them.

[01:30:19]Josh: Yeah. And man, I think you bring up a really good point when it comes to like education, as what you've been doing, where you find a peer group or like a mentor, and you're surrounding yourself with people who are levels ahead of you, then you're getting pulled up a level.

[01:30:31] Whereas with traditional education, you're with people either at your level or lower, you know, so sure you're learning some things from teachers or whatever, but then you're also like seeing some questionable things, especially if you're in like most colleges or universities are, you're going to experience some questionable shit.

[01:30:46] So I think that's a really good point of like leveling up. It's like, you can almost like pull yourself up or get pulled up a

[01:30:52] Mitch: You naturally, you naturally ascend when you're around people like that, because I was in a mastermind last weekend that I had to tell him, I was telling you about. And like the guys in there, one guy was doing like 900 grand a month. Another one was doing like, uh, Like he was literally doing like $150,000 a day in revenue.

[01:31:14] Right. Which is probably like 3 million or something a month or 2 million a month. And so like, people like that, it's like, this is the new standard. Right. And it's like, I have to get to this level. Or I knew naturally ascend up because just the way they operate and the way they think. Right. And I feel like getting like constantly investing in yourself, is it, uh, it not only puts a responsibility, I think on you, like, like you're one of, you're trying to get your money's worth.

[01:31:42] And two, you're trying to just level up and advance. Right. And I feel like getting to that next level and like dropping five grand or 10 grand on a mentor, 50 grand, like I do. Right. It's it's you constantly, like, I started out with like obviously books and then lower level courses. And I kept like buying like $2,000 course thousand dollar course, $5,000, $8,000 course, $50,000 mastermind.

[01:32:12] You can't see the kind of ascend as you start to get better as yourself. But, um, yeah, I think leveling up and getting you learn through osmosis to getting into that, that, uh, that environment is, is critical. Like it's, it's vital.

[01:32:27] Josh: Oh, dude, that's exactly why I do this podcast. Like talk about S curves, talk about like, you know, getting access to these people. That's like the sole reason why I started this podcast and I can also give back. Right. So not only we have in this conversation and my goal is to eventually like, you know, leverage past conversations and may eventually audience to be able to speak to higher level people, but I can share it with other people.

[01:32:50] Right. So it's like, people are fly on the walls right now. Like, we're recording this now, but someone could be listening to this, like a year or two later, 10 years later, like, who knows, like, especially one of these gets split up into clips and they're on YouTube. Like who knows how they get resurfaced in VR. Right.

[01:33:06] So like, that's exactly why I started the podcast, man. It's like to get access to people like that and then share that knowledge with others. Cause like, I think that's a lot of people are getting like college level education through podcasts. Now, anybody who listens to like all in podcast or like invest like the best or my first million, any of these podcasts, like you're getting better education than like a lecture lecture that you're paying like 20 grand, 30 or 50 grand a year on like it's insane.

[01:33:35] Free content online and you're getting access to people. And like, obviously there's different levels of fidelity, right? Like, like you said, you could either be reading a book and reading what they wrote down. Uh, it could be a podcast or watching a video of them. Like a lot of these people like Ray Dalio, you know, you have his books, you can also read or watch his videos.

[01:33:55] And then the next level of that is like having calls with him and actually speaking to him one-on-one which is why did the podcast? So maybe it's possible. I could eventually actually speak to them. And of course the next layer of that is like actually working with them. One-on-one um, whether it was like, you do like a joint venture with them or something.

[01:34:12] I remember you have like this sort of vision of maybe one day working with grant Cardone or something where it's like,

[01:34:17] Mitch: I don't know about grant Cardone,

[01:34:19] Josh: is what, something like that, you know, one day you're, you're, you're consuming their content the next day, you know, you're bringing them business opportunities and they're like, yeah, like let's work together.

[01:34:29] So I think it's really interesting, like what media can do, um, you know, leveraging stuff. Like I start small, like, this is not a large podcast, but like who knows what we'll be talking about or who comes into this podcast like a year or 10 years. But what it is is compounding knowledge,

[01:34:46] Mitch: yep. No it's yeah,

[01:34:49] Josh: you know, so I think everyone needs some like that.

[01:34:51] And I think for you getting into YouTube is also that right, like building that audience and putting out more content learning stuff. So then you have to then go and put out that content. Cause you have to learn first to be able to put it out.

[01:35:01] Mitch: Well, I think you also learn a lot through sharing it and teaching it, right? Like I'm S I'm certain like a lot of the concepts that you had in your mind from reading books, cause I know you read a lot of books and interesting concepts and different topics that you read is like, when you start to talk about them, you're then teaching others or you're explaining others.

[01:35:22] And then that's also solidifying and deepening that root of your understanding inside yourself as well. And so that's why I love. You know, I'll tell you this, the most transformation in it that I had was also building my program. Cause I got to like condense it, simplify and synthesize the information so that someone can consume it in an easy, like dead, simple way and implement it right.

[01:35:45] Similar with YouTube. Like that's why I think over time, yeah. Just building that up and sharing the insights. It also helps you become better too, which is

[01:35:53] Josh: Dude. That's a really good point. Yeah. Cause you're really thinking about it. CA if I'm someone else who has no idea about any of this stuff, how would I want to learn about this? How can I

[01:36:03] Mitch: That's the hardest point.

[01:36:04] Josh: and elegant? It's so hard.

[01:36:06] Mitch: synthesizing the information. Right. And teaching it in a way that's also going to produce the result. It's it's really interesting. Yeah.

[01:36:15] Josh: Yeah, like I'm thinking, man, like I went to four years of university. Sure, I covered a lot of ground and I, I did much more than just media production, but I could condense what I learned in four years of like spending tens of thousands of dollars into like a couple hours of a course. Right. It's or you can learn a lot of stuff for free on YouTube nowadays is pretty wild,

[01:36:35] Mitch: It's I think college would have been, would have been only good essentially to like meet other people. Like you meet some pretty interesting people and like you have a good time, but for me, I just wanted to accelerate my wealth building and wealth generation. So I was like, fuck that. But, um, yeah.

[01:36:57] It's definitely a good, good podcast. Good, good model. And building that up and building the, like a quote unquote social currency

[01:37:05] Josh: dude. Yeah. It's social currency. I think about this all the time and I'll be completely transparent to hear anyone listening to, and I'll tell you this right now, Mitch. It's like, one of the reasons I'm doing this too, is like, it's almost like research I'm like, I don't know what that product will be. Even if it's a book I've been thinking about a book where it's sort of like, you know, we're talking about video games quite a bit and like grand theft auto.

[01:37:25] Remember you'd get those like game cheat code books that would give you a cheat codes, you know, tell you about the world. And it'd be like, you know, a game guide. I want to build or write or illustrate something like that for like entrepreneurship and being in this world. Right. So if I can like talk to people like you and other people in the podcast to just get their ideas and philosophies on the world, I can start getting other viewpoints are not just my own.

[01:37:53] I can get all these different ideas, put it all into one nice package. Well, that's book. I know like Tim Ferriss has done that with like tools of Titans and it's basically a transcript of the podcast. What I'm thinking of doing something a little bit different, right. It'd be like a full on guide. But, um, and what that kind of, it brings me into sort of this last topic I want to talk about for this podcast with you, which is like the lattice work of knowledge that you've talked about.

[01:38:18] That's kind of your terminology for it. A lot of people call it like just straight up knowledge management, but what I was just describing there, like taking all these different seemingly unconnected ideas and start connecting them, you're calling it like a latticework of knowledge. I know you got that from somewhere else too.

[01:38:34] So maybe you can kind of like, um, dig deeper on that and kind of explain what you mean by that. And maybe how you've started developing your own, uh, lattice work.

[01:38:43] Mitch: Yeah. And like, I also let's like the unified field theory, right. In, I think physics, right. Where you have a unified, like you have all these disciplines that you're learning. Right. And you're again, simply synthesizing them down and learning the core principles and the mental models and then how they relate interconnect with each other into one core thing.

[01:39:09] And then that's what makes really good entrepreneur like th like, or even just person is like, if you just know one thing, like say you just know psychology. That's one thing, one of the flaws I think about university or college or whatever is they only teach you like one discipline for myself. As an entrepreneur business owner, I had to learn finance.

[01:39:29] I had to learn accounting. I had to learn marketing sales. I had to learn copywriting. I had to learn, um, literally like building out like actual products. Right. I had to learn so many mindset psychology. I had to learn all of that. And then how can I synthesize them and how can I interconnect them and learn the principles of the disciplines to produce like the it's called the Lollapalooza effect is what, and I learned this from Charlie Munger, he's Warren Buffett's business partner.

[01:40:00] If you don't know if you know him, he has a book called, um, poor Charlie's Almanac. And he also has something called the 25 cognitive biases. And he talks about in his book, or I don't know if he wrote it, but, um, in the book it talks about one of them is, which is the Lollapalooza Effect, which is when all of those kind of converge. And they condense into like one effect that has a, um, unevenly distribution reaction in a sense.

[01:40:30] So for example, taking like these disciplines of learning, for example, if you learn like software as a service, you learn psychology, you learn accounting, math, all these different things, and then it converges in and you create like Slack or you create like Tik Tok and it just billion-dollar company.

[01:40:49] Right? And so like sometimes they all converged down into like one thing. And then you have, again, I don't know if that was the case, but it's an example. Or, you know, you create, you know, you, you make a trade in the financial markets, everything comes together, you invest in some big company or Bitcoin or wherever at the right time. And you just have these exponential results.

[01:41:08] But thinking about that in terms of, uh, when everything comes together, that's really what the Lollapalooza effect is. And like you said, creating that lattice work of learning these different disciplines, right? So I know you learned like art music, all of these different things and business entrepreneurship, you know, mindset psychology.

[01:41:27] You're able to condense all these different disciplines down by understanding their core principles. I think that is a prerequisite in this world to succeed is being what Sam, my mentor calls full stack being full stack. Right. And that's what I like to call it interdisciplinary. And when you do that, man, like you'll just become a force because he having so many different things to pull from.

[01:41:55] And a good example of is Elon Musk. He knows engineering. He knows, okay. In building rocket ships, you know, it's like so many different things. And that's why he's able to create in like, think from different perspectives, because he's able to take, for example, principles from physics or principles from, um, biology or, you know, mathematics or whatever he's doing from like rocket science. And he's able to apply them maybe to like Tesla or solar city or these other companies.

[01:42:22] Josh: dude, I don't know if you heard the new, a Roadster, they're going to have a P space X version of it. Very special. It's gonna be like a hundred thousand dollars or more, or something like that. It's gonna be a special edition of the new Tesla Roadster 2.0 space X edition. And it's literally going to be able to fucking hover. It's going to be a fucking hover car because they're taking stuff from space X.

[01:42:43] Mitch: That's like the Lollapalooza effect. Right. You can see like certain things where you're taking them and they kind of converge into one, like again, asymmetrical reaction or result. It's pretty, pretty interesting.

[01:42:59] Josh: It's pretty interesting. How much have you been like looking into that? Like what do you, what do you research for that? Like how do you even start going about that? And when you were thinking about your own, how do you manage that? And I think that's why. Things like Roam Research, right now are becoming such a big thing because of Roam Notions kind of, but more so Roam is exactly that. It's a tool that allows you to start making these interconnections between different things and different ideas.

[01:43:27] And I'm really toying with the idea of starting to use it more and start adding my notes in here. And how do you make these connections? Like, do you think you need these tools? Maybe

[01:43:35] Mitch: I don't think so. I don't think so. Because organizing your knowledge is an important thing, but

[01:43:44] Josh: That's how I found the Ken show in Satori dude. Cause I was able to command P on notion and I just searched Satori

[01:43:50] and I had it

[01:43:51] Mitch: eventually you're going to have a neural link in your brain

[01:43:54] Josh: What do you think about that, man? Do you actually think that'll actually work? Are you afraid? I'm kind of afraid of that. Like, I mean, there's obviously

[01:44:00] Mitch: cyborgs. I'm of like, I robot like that sketches me out. Like, I don't know what to think about it. I just, if it's managed properly, but I just don't like how the fact that they could learn faster than us and eventually, you know, take over the world. I dunno.

[01:44:22] Josh: well, I think that's why Elon is making that right. He's like, Hey, if like we're going to have AI, we need something that will keep us. Yeah. And you talk about that a lot merging man with machine. So maybe it's inevitable that it's going to happen at some

[01:44:34] Mitch: Well, you technically are right with the phone. It's just like Elon talks about is the connection is, is through your actual input and

[01:44:43] Josh: thumb.

[01:44:44] Mitch: Yeah. Slow. He's like, is it instant? Right in imagine your brain is connected straight to Google or straight, you know, you can literally snap in a second and you literally know anything.

[01:44:54] But in terms of what you're saying then like, uh, I think with, um, yeah, organizing the knowledge. I think it comes -from though, like honestly, a deep understanding of the topic in of itself and learning the principles because principles are timeless. If you can learn the principles, you can, it's like, you can hang, you can hang anything upon that. Once you learn the principles and the core discipline, then you can build it from first principles thinking and different models, like critical thinking and, you know, being able to create.

[01:45:33] Your own creation, like basically have a, your own creation through understanding these things at a deep level and what to answer your question also, how I, how I think about and how I learned it was one, I also obviously created a module on it, but through that exploratory thing, like I was consuming a lot about how you think about it and how it's kind of, you build it into your own unified field theory and how you see the world and everything.

[01:46:04] Right. And it's about learning. Like you learn different things over time, not for the sake of learning them, but for the sake of advancing and building certain skillsets or advancing in certain portions of your life or business. Right. And you just stack them.

[01:46:21] So for example, I have to learn accounting. I have to learn financials. I have to learn marketing media, buying, paid advertising. I had to learn all these things. And like, I have to, because they like it's necessary for my business to succeed and profit and constantly grow, you know? And so like, once you learn at a core level, then you kind of like stack them. Right. And I think just thinking about it from that level, I do have like different folders where I kind of keep my, uh, my learnings, but it's not like organized, like you like a notion or Roman research or whatever.

[01:46:58] It's like, I'm just trying to like thoroughly understand it myself. And then apply it and master it in a sense. And then I can like, again, like you're saying use a lot just to kind of overlap them and interconnect them. So I it's, it's, it's embedded into my mentor, my brain.

[01:47:19] Josh: Right. I think that's where tools like Roam or notion does come in. Right? Like you have like different full, like whatever it is, a folder structure. There's a lot of great, again, like programs out there now and like courses like building a second brain that teach you how to like do this stuff. It's like building literally

[01:47:33] Mitch: Well, you're really good with technology man. Like the one thing I really liked too, and what I've seen with you is using Kindle or using Notion and being able to like use them really efficiently and effectively. I think for myself, I never, I I'm like a guy that's still like pulls out a pen and a physical book and underlines them.

[01:47:52] Right. And I write in the book and I write in a notebook. Right. I kind of liked that because it's more real, I don't know more real for me, but I've more increasingly been using Kendall and I always go back to like my highlights and I'm able to like really get that knowledge back and then take it and put it into a place where I can like easily access it and just access to the information in like the right information.

[01:48:18] Right. Because in a book you're only going to have finite amount of that's actually useful, applicable to your life. And then, like you said, being able to use tools like Notion that's searchable, that's indexable, and then you can like. You know, it's like a filing cabinet. You can pull it out. Bam. It's right into your, into your brain and you can get any answer, right?

[01:48:36] Josh: And I, I think Roam is different. It's not like a filing cabinet thing. I'm going to, I'm still trying to get the founder on there. Dude, when I have him on Connor, you gotta listen to it. Cause like he's fucking brilliant. This guy, just like, it's a whole new way of literally thinking. Cause like it is taking this idea that we're talking about the lattice work of connected thoughts and there's so many people I know that use it daily and I'm like, I just haven't been able to do it. Notion has some of the tools and I just I've been using notion, but I need to get into using Roam I think this will now become my excuse to using it.

[01:49:05] But to your point of like the Kindles and stuff, the only reason I started using it originally was because I did a lot of traveling. Like when I went to Japan and stuff, it made no sense to carry like five thick ass books.

[01:49:15] Right. But to have this one little Kindle, you can have it. Then I realized, Oh, you know, the highlighting is great. And then I started using this app called read wise, dude, you should check it out. It automatically syncs all of your highlights from Kindles, from, from your Kindle. And it will then send it to Roam or send it to notion.

[01:49:31] So you can have all just your highlights and the nice document. But the other thing it does, it's really cool is every day it'll send you an email with random highlights from all the books you read. So it's like a roulette man. One day you open it up like, Oh, this was from a book I read like five years ago.

[01:49:45] Like what, what in your Holy shit, this somehow is related to I was thinking about the other day and I can now apply it. It's really cool. It's a really cool little,

[01:49:53]Mitch: Well, in terms of reading, how do you find reading books, just consistently every day to be how you learn or do you also like to like go at it from the standpoint of like, here's like what I'm trying to do and let me read this book on this topic now. Like how do, how do you, or what's the best mode of reading for you?

[01:50:14]Josh: This is new for me, and this is gonna maybe blow my mind even, but through this podcast. Um, and I think you saw my YouTube video of how I do my yearly review. One question was, how do you like to learn? Like, what was your best way of learning? And I just realized the way that I learned most effectively out of anything, books, whatever is through this podcast and through my editing process of this.

[01:50:39] And this is like next level shit, dude. So after we're done this conversation, I bring this into Descript. Which is a tool that transcribes it. So I go through every God damn word, like I'm reading. This can make a two hour conversation, go through every word. And what I do is I highlight the words, just like I would highlight a Kindle, like, Oh, this piece was great because a, I want to learn it.

[01:51:01] And B, that can be a great snippet for Tik Tok or Instagram or Facebook. Right? So it's like for content production, but because I'm literally highlighting and McCain, this part here just like you would be highlighting a book. I'm like, this is really interesting. Then what I do is I add detailed shownotes.

[01:51:18] So man, you can go on my website, anyone listening to this, go to the show notes for this, like, it's like, step-by-step I write notes on this, like I'm in a fucking like university lecture on every episode. So that's why I only do one episode per week because I go so deep on each conversation. I dissect every word, every idea.

[01:51:35] I'm like, Oh, this is a tool. This is a book that was mentioned. This was a resource. This was something. And like, I go deep on that. But now these were all separate episodes, right? This will eventually be hundreds of episodes. What happens then when I start taking those highlights, put, throw, throw those into Roam and start connecting them.

[01:51:51] What the hell happens then, man, that's when you get what you talked about, the Lollapalooza effect. So that's been how I love to learn books. Yes. Reading. Yes. Watching videos. Yes. But I've found having conversation, asking the question, going through the answers, making show notes, making highlights to be the most effective for me. And it was like wringing out every ounce of juice from this, you know?

[01:52:14] Mitch: Yeah, no, that's interesting. Yeah. Conversations are, they connect. Cause it's, it's interactive. It's not like a static book that you love. You can't like have a conversation with the other person that wrote it unless you get on the phone with them. Right. But some of them are, you know, some of the books that we read like Meditations by Marcus Aurelius was like, you know, whenever the, the, the 10 80 or whatever, you know, and it's, uh, you know, you're not, you can't have those conversations with Socrates and whoever, you know,

[01:52:46] Josh: There are

[01:52:47] Mitch: uh,

[01:52:47] Josh: right? And you can do it through books. You can do it through videos, That's exactly it too. Right? Like you can learn through podcasts just as you do through books. Like people listen to audio books, podcasts at the same, it can be a little rough around the edges. That's why I like to edit these out and make it like a pretty highly produced.

[01:53:03] Right. So like when people are listening back on it, it's like a nice, neat package of like these ideas. So I know that's kind of how I've been doing it, man.

[01:53:11] How about you? How about when it comes to like reading and stuff? What is your preferred method or how do you make sure things stick or, you know,

[01:53:17] Mitch: yeah. Well, it's interesting because the last two years, the year before last like 2019, I was in just straight doing mode where I was not, I was just doing sales, marketing and growing my business. And like, I maybe read a few books that year, but I learned more about sales than any book ever could have taught me.

[01:53:46] Because I learned by, I learned a lot by doing or like simulation as well. I think that I learned a lot through that. And then, um, yeah, and then like when I was in 2020, I spent a lot of my time. I learned a lot by synthesizing my information, what I learned about sales and what I learned about business up until that point.

[01:54:06] And I was able to really sit and think about it and then it just seeped into my being these different things. So I learned a lot that way, but typically how I learn is by doing or through simulation, like how I learned to trade was on a demo account. Right. How I learned actually initially how to do sales was through role-playing sales calls.

[01:54:25] Right. And so I learned a lot about, and I wish they had something like that for like Facebook ads, YouTube paths, because then you can learn it without the low and thousands of dollars. But

[01:54:35] in a,

[01:54:36] Josh: be a good point. Yeah, but I, it w it wouldn't work cause he would actually do it.

[01:54:39] Mitch: You simulate impressions and clicks.

[01:54:43] Josh: That's interesting. That's an interesting point, dude.

[01:54:46] Mitch: good. May create a demo account for a YouTube.

[01:54:50] Josh: Demo account. You just, I think right now it's just, you have to be okay with losing money, right? Just like, yeah. It's kind of a gamble. How do you think about that? Like when you're putting, when you're testing ads and stuff on YouTube,

[01:55:01] Mitch: Well, you got it. Learn. You got to learn the, you got to learn again this, like I was saying before, learning the core components of it, what makes it work right. And. You got to really have a good strong hypothesis. And one of these guys, Peter Drucker, I don't know if you know who he is, but he's like really use a big in business and you've heard a lot of books and he was like, I don't know what he actually did.

[01:55:26] I think he was at Harvard or something, but he has this one quote where he's like, if you understand the customer so well, that's when sales become redundant. And so a lot of it goes into knowing the customer from the actual conversion process, which the video or sales page, and then from the ad who you're calling out, getting into the funnel.

[01:55:47] And so that's, what's really makes it work. And then I would say, you just need to be an analyst looking at the data whenever you're doing that type of thing. Right. It's good hypothesis, good product. I'd say if you have a really good product and you can deliver results, it will work. And again, it's different on different platforms, but a sales call funnel was way more forgiving than some other types of advertising you can do because of the margins.

[01:56:15] Right.

[01:56:15] Josh: Oh, yeah. E-commerce and stuff. Yeah. Like shout out to Longboi here. It's thin, man. It's hard, especially when you're doing cold, cold, a cold ad. So we're trying to play around with some stuff too, when it comes to that, it's,

[01:56:27] Mitch: You'll win an upsells and stuff.

[01:56:30] Josh: But especially when we're in a world of monopolies, right. I guess it's like oligopoly right now.

[01:56:35] You have Facebook, Google and Amazon. Who else? Who else do we have? Like, not, not for ads that could, if you're

[01:56:44] Mitch: Yeah. Yeah.

[01:56:45] Josh: right? I mean, tick tock, tick tock. Finally we have Tik Tok is different. Like tick is out of there, but yeah. Yeah. Google with Google and Google display ads and, and, uh, Google search ads

[01:56:55] Mitch: you'd be surprised. Google. Google is actually, that's why I'm pretty bullish on just Google ads. I wouldn't say just YouTube ads because they own a lot. They own the two largest search engines in the world, Google and YouTube. Right. And so it's pretty interesting, man, but yeah. Ads are a different beast of its own, but

[01:57:17] Josh: Oh, yeah, we can go deep on ads at one point. Yeah. Cause you're, you're switching completely to YouTube, right? Like focusing on Google or YouTube. Yep. No more Facebook ads. What do you think that will do for their, their stock now that they're kind of like fucking around with a bunch of people's accounts and slash and accounts?

[01:57:33] Mitch: Well, I think what's happening is larger corporations or larger corporations are spending more money on that. Right. And so, but from the standpoint of what? Well, yeah, well, from my understanding, they would rather have a lot of advertisers spending a little bit of money so that there's no concentration on one particular, like, for example, if like, I don't know Walmart or one of these big companies just like storm the market.

[01:58:10] And every time you turn your Facebook app, you just seen Walmart ads all, all day. You'd probably never go back on Facebook. Right? And so they want to make sure that there's, uh, their, their users are getting the ads that are going to be of interest to them that are going to get them to buy the things that they wouldn't be most likely to buy, because that's also how they make money as if their advertisers make money.

[01:58:31] So it's interesting though, how, why they're doing that, but I think they're just doing it for quality and, um, but a lot of people are, they're messing around with a lot of people and people are moving to at a platforms and Google, they never had a problem with them. I've talked to every, like everyone I've talked to, they've never had a problem with them.

[01:58:51] And so, and their support is supposedly good or decent. So again, when you mess with someone's customers, they move somewhere else.

[01:59:00] Josh: That's true. I'm excited to tryTik Tok tooo man. I'm really interested. I know seriously and people talk shit. I think Tik Tok, even organic. And I told you this figure to your YouTube videos, talking about repurposing them, dude, post little pieces of them on Tik Tok, and you will be so surprised. No tick tock, tick tock.

[01:59:18] And then you do the same video on reels. The thing about reels is only up to 30 seconds. Tech talk is up to one minute and I think they're playing with it being going up to six minutes now. So I think Tik Tok will be sort of like the next like YouTube type of platform. It's more of like a media platform than it is like social it's good.

[01:59:38] I really, really like tick-tock um, I haven't paid for any paid ads on there yet, man, but just from the ads I do see I'm like, I'm watching it for like. 30 seconds. And Merce's like, you know, you're watching an ad, right? I'm like, wait, what? That was an ad. Like it's so subtle. And like, they're the way that people do advertising is so integrated that it looks like it's just another tech talk video.

[02:00:01] And when they're good, man, I'm telling you they're good. Like you're watching it for like a good 30 seconds before you realize in the bottom corner that it's a sponsored ad. You're like, Whoa, this is weird. Crazy, man. It's it's next level I'm telling you, TikTok is next level. And if you curate your feed, you will, for me, anytime I turn on Tik Tok, I'm learning something.

[02:00:21] It's something to do with my interest. It's not bullshit. Yeah. Sometimes there's funny shit because I like funny shit. Sometimes sprinkle that in there. Right. Um, but I've curated mine. That every time I open up, I'm like, here's a new hack with like Google ads. Here's a new hack with this. Or here's that? I'm like, Oh, the cool little things, life hacks, you know, like funny little things.

[02:00:40] Mitch: I dunno, man. I, I fucking just deleted all my social media is like, I, I sometimes down sometimes

[02:00:45] down. Yeah.

[02:00:46] Josh: social media, man. It's not, I'm telling you right now. Tik TOK is not social media. It's just media. It's another YouTube. It's all dopamine. It is. It's like heroin, right? I mean, if you look at the, the it's it's digital heroin, meth,

[02:00:59] Mitch: yeah.

[02:01:01] But yeah, if you use it productively, I think it's good.

[02:01:03] Josh: Yeah. With anything, right? Like your computer, you can use it for porn to jerk off 24 seven, or you could like make money with it, right. Like it's just infinite computer, right?

[02:01:13] And actually you could do both. I mean, I'm sure you can make porn and make a lot of money too. I don't know. I haven't done it yet. Yet. I'm just kidding. Mind Meld XXX now. Genital Meld is the next no kidding. Um, got to sprinkle some humor in here, man. I don't like things to be too serious.

[02:01:33] I'm just looking at my notes over here. Um, cause I have like these sort of final questions before we get going, because we got to wake up early tomorrow, man. We are moving our father, moving our dad into his new condo. Folks, you get a little bit of slice of life here. It's almost like a podcast meets a vlog almost.

[02:01:50] I don't know. We're going to be moving our dad in tomorrow. So we got to get going soon. But before we go and dude, I have a couple questions for you, um, that like to sort of end things off and I like to do this at least for the first one. Cause I want to do more of these with you where we can like branch off, like, uh, you know, just listening to this conversation, dude.

[02:02:08] Yeah, let's do it man. A

[02:02:09] Mitch: I want to do a

[02:02:10] Josh: We'll do let's do it. I want to get into it and we'll definitely do more podcasts. We'll do more of these just Mind Meld and dude, it's just open-ended right. . But before we get going, dude, I want to ask you in, like, let's just say you were to meet 10 year older Mitch. He comes back in like a time machine in a portal comes walking into your room. What does he tell you, man? What does ten-year-old Mitch tell Mitch today?

[02:02:36] Mitch: like 10 year old me or 10 years in

[02:02:39] Josh: So 10, 10 years in the future, Mitch tell Mitch today.

[02:02:43] Mitch: well, I don't know. Cause I'm not that 10 years person yet.

[02:02:46] Josh: Okay. Okay. So what would you tell ten-year-old Mitch right now? If you, right now, you had a time machine, what would you go back and tell ten-year-old Mitch?

[02:02:54] Mitch: yeah, that's a good question. I would tell myself to start early and hang out with the right people and I would probably start reading books and starting to really build up my self confidence and my self image, like from an early age and like get into the mindset in like for today. That cause when I have like, in that age, I, by this time I'd probably be way ahead of my I'll probably be created.

[02:03:23] Like, I dunno like a Zuckerberg billion company by this stage because I did start pretty young too, but I would say yeah, just reading books in and like really channeling that confidence and that winning mentality and just all aspects of life. And starting early, starting to read books, starting to build those habits, starting to invest in yourself early at an early age, and just constantly, you know, put yourself in the position where you're in the right place at the wrong time, because I was constantly in the wrong place at the wrong time with the wrong people.

[02:03:57] And so just putting yourself in the right place at the right time with the right people, good things are going to happen naturally and starting to be on that pathway of that continuous non ending learning. And self-improvement right building up that really strong self-confidence that strong fortitude in your mind, resilience, newness, and just pushing through anything and tapping into again, remembering who the fuck you are and pushing through anything.

[02:04:27] And just knowing that you can literally accomplish anything that you set your mind to, and you can become anyone that you've built inside your mind.

[02:04:35]Josh: Oh, man. I love that. are there any particular books that you would recommend yourself? Hey,

[02:04:40] Mitch: Relentless, Relentless by Tim Grover. Psycho-Cybernetics Awaken The Giant Within by Tony Robbins. And what's another one I'd say, Think and Grow Rich. And there's rich dad. Poor dad.

[02:04:58] Josh: Uh, yeah, those are good ones. Are those like the first ones that people get into? Like, you know, when they're starting their journey too. what is something that your, um, you're really excited for right now? Like what are you looking to the future? What are you super excited about right now?

[02:05:13]Mitch: I'm super excited about creating just amazing products that people love and, and experiences. I don't know. It's interesting. I really fell in love with helping people transform themselves in their businesses. Like I get fired up about that and I'm really excited. And I wake up every day of like, how can I help and push this forward?

[02:05:44] And, you know, just get to the point where that person is, like, if they, I can just give someone what I wish I had when I started and get them to the level that I am at now, or way surpassed mine in a shorter amount of time, with less, less mistakes and a more profound result and with less complexity and hurdles that had to be jumped over. So I'm trying to like compress that all in like, I just really excited for that.

[02:06:18] And I'm just excited for, you know, building a good, productive business that helps a lot of people and doing things that I love to do. Cause I, I realized that I just don't, I don't do things these days that I don't necessarily love to do. It's like, I love doing this and I love building these things and creating good community and good products and services for my customers. That's really all I care about. And like what I'm excited about everyday.

[02:06:45]Josh: Yeah, dude. That's awesome. Yeah. You got to have somebody that, you know, wakes you up and gets you fired up every morning. And it's got to embed that in who you are. So I'm glad that you found that, man. It's hard for a lot of people just don't find that thing. Um, you know, so it's great that you've found that and you're helping other people find it themselves. So that's definitely something you'd be

[02:07:01] Mitch: that's also a fires me up. Right. Helping other people find that in themselves, that's, that's a truly an impact you make. Cause it's like a ripple effect, right?

[02:07:12] Josh: Yeah, absolutely man. So before we head out, man, where can people find you online? Where do you want them to go to get a little bit more of Mitch, your YouTube channel and stuff? So yeah, wherever people can go, um, any links, any kind of things you want to shout out.

[02:07:27] Mitch: Yeah. So we'll link that one module that you can check out on my YouTube channel as well, but definitely check out my YouTube channel, um, release videos every week on mindset, business sales, marketing, literally anything to help you in your life and business. And then also LinkedIn, you can connect with me on LinkedIn.

[02:07:44] It's just. Um, linkedin.com/in/mitchgonsalves. So you can just easily search it up or you can search it on there and you can find that and connect with me. I'll accept it. Tell me you're from Josh's podcast, Mind Meld and, uh, yeah, YouTube is the best place to connect with me there. Subscribe, smash that like button and, uh, for the YouTube algorithm. I think that's what they say these days.

[02:08:09] Josh: Yeah. Smash the like button. If you're watching this on YouTube as well. And if you're listening to this on like Spotify or whatever, hit subscribe, seriously. Just pull that phone, pull that phone out of your pocket. You're if you're on a walk, if you're at the gym, just take that phone, your phone, make sure you go to the app that you're listening to this on. Swipe. use your face ID, finger ID. I don't know what fucking device you have. Unlock that bitch and hit the subscribe button and subscribe to this podcast.. And then go over to Mitch's YouTube channel,

[02:08:43]Mitch: Sounds like you're on the mob man. Like

[02:08:47] break your legs.

[02:08:49] Josh: Okay. Gun to your head. You have five seconds to subscribe. Go.

[02:08:53] Mitch: That's a heavy, heavy call to action.

[02:08:56] Josh: heavy call to action. Literally click this button or die. We have a drone outside of your window pointed into your apartment, you're going to die. I'm kidding. No, one's going to die. People that I don't know. I hope like Google doesn't pick this up and they're like flagging this for shit. Fucking FBI. My FBI agents already outside the door. We're going to kick the door open.

[02:09:20] All right, Mitchell, I'm excited to see more of your YouTube videos, dude. Guys. Thank you so much for listening. Go check out Mitch's YouTube channel. Go connect with him on LinkedIn and don't forget to subscribe to the podcast and we'll see you next time. Take care. Have a good night. Good morning. Good afternoon. Wherever you listen to this. All right, bye.

Thanks for coming this far! if you're reading this, it is no accident. The universe brought you to this corner of the internet for a reason, and you're on the right track. I already know that you're an amazing person and I can't wait to connect with you!

— Josh

Episode Transcript

Josh Gonsalves
Mind Meld Podcast Host

Hi, I'm Josh Gonsalves, the host and producer of Mind Meld. I'm also a Canadian Academy Award-nominated director and Co-founder of Contraverse, an immersive media company. I'm a multi-media experience designer living and working in Toronto, operating at the intersection of design and exponential technologies to develop solutions that change the world for the better.

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